MB-CLS500

What would be the difference between these two? They have different serial and part numbers but they are both 12v-24v

Mackhack

Every car has a different serial number aka VIN. And Two different products have two different part numbers. It's like comparing Snickers with M&Ms.

MB-CLS500

yes man you are so righ LOL I KNOW THAT THEY ARE LIKE SNICKERS AND M&MS OR MAY BE MARS AND BOUNTY THATS WHY I ASKED THIS QUESTION IF ANYBODY KNEW WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THEM AND YOU DEFENETLY DO NOT KNOW IT OR DO YOU?


Soo Thats the purpose of the question these two products look the same have same name (EMP WP29) both 24v but have different part numbers so there is must be some difference between them? may be one is better than the other?

Mackhack

Don't yell! You're question fits right into the nonsense category.

If you know why different products have different serials and part numbers then what's the real question? One apparently runs with 12 the other with 24V. Not more not less without doing the homework for you. Read the manual(s) and you will find your answer. We're not here to read and comprehend it for you. That's your job.

And if you can't take a joke, too bad for you.

ZephTheChef

I dunno. They both say 24V pumps. Probably different revisions of the exact same product. I have that pump in 24V...got a steal on it because everybody's after the 12V ones. Haven't gotten a power supply rigged up for it yet, but I plan on installing it eventually. Best intercooler pump money can buy in my opinion (the 24V version has a lot higher pressure capability...it's just a matter of figure out how to power it, lol.)

MB-CLS500

First off all they are same products Both EMP WP29 and if YOU would see the pictures attached to my question 24V are written on back of both.

Second Ok I understand if they have different serial numbers its like when two CL600 2007 for example having different VIN codes .( same products different Numbers)

BUT in mechanical engineering world same parts have same part numbers and these do not have same part numbers so there is gotta be some difference between them. I read all the PDFs and documents and I am currently waiting for emp-corp.com customer account approval to get access for more pdf documents wich you can look up with part numbers . There is only install manuals online. AND PLEASE you have really bad sense of humor and I am going thew nicotine withdrawal its my second day and dont get on my nerves please have a good day .

these are like snickers and m&ms

ZephTheChef

On that note, does anybody have any cheap ideas? I have adjustable output boost converters, but one isn't going to run this pump steady-state (I think they are rated something like 268 watts continuous each) but I do have two of them laying around.

I may be better off just reselling this pump and just paying full price for a 12V one.

ZephTheChef

Please share if you find any interesting documents when you get access. And congrats on quitting the tobacco. Stay strong!

MB-CLS500

I think they are multi voltage because 1 guy who was selling this pump on other forum said that its 24V and he was running it with 12V

Quote


Stewart EMP WP29 Water Pump
Selling a used Stewart EMP WP29 Water Pump, 24v version with 1"inlet/outlet. Used it with 12v for about a month and it works great! Need to install a G-force intake which routes exactly where this pump is mounted and can't find anywhere else to easily mount, so my loss is your gain. Looking for $310 shipped, also comes with brand new Deutch connector. These retail for almost $500
Will be taken out today so i can post pics later on.

Based on what he said that 1 should think these pumps are multivoltage? I will share all the documents when I get access

MB-CLS500

U have EMP WP29 pump??

ZephTheChef

I do not think the 24V pump should be run on lower voltage. The instructions specify a minimum operating voltage of 18V and a max of 32V. I suppose you could, but I would worry about the interals of the pump. The pump performance is not that much different between the 12v pump and the 24v...it's just that the 24v maintains more flow at the 25psi point on the graph than the 12V. And that's with both of them receiving the ideal voltage (14 and 28 volts) Other than that they are pretty much the same.

So if you run the 24V pump on 12V, it's probably only seeing 1/2 or 1/4 of the wattage it would at 24V and performance is going to suffer greatly. Either that or the pump will try and draw way too much amperage and burn up the wiring internally. I'm not an expert on electric motors by any means so I can't say for sure what would happen.

ZephTheChef

Yes, I managed to find the 24V version you linked for about $150 used so I jumped on it and figured I could figure out how to power it later. But it looks like coming up with a reliable power source could cost more than just buying the proper 12V pump.

ZephTheChef

Now you've got me wondering, because I know there are lots of electronics built into this thing so I'm sure it's got protections against this sort of thing. I may run some flow tests through those spare intercoolers at 12V and 24V and see what the pump performance is like. I certainly don't want to burn the thing up, but I would like to know what happens real-world if you try and run the 24V on 12V.

MB-CLS500

It must be multivoltage I also asked EMP corp that question but im not sure lets wait emp corp to confirm and as far as I understand they are multi voltage in pdf there is 28v that runs on 14v and 28v and other one runs on 12v and 24v these are best pumps for us to use coz it says 10K+ hours of life compared to 3K hours of life to meziere that is 125 days

Mackhack

Are there any useful tests with that pump? Flow under pressure and how much lower IAT is going to be?

ZephTheChef

Water flow by itself isn't going to reduce IATs. All it does is ensure that you've got a larger mass flow of water/coolant through the intercoolers which will result in a lower average water temp throughout the intercooler IF you have enough system capacity or heat exchanger to continue to remove heat.

It doesn't, for example, provide you any benefits if your system capacity is say only a gallon and your heat exchanger can't actively keep up with the cooling demands. But yes, EMP does provide flow data for their pumps at various pressures. It's in the install manual.

http://www.emp-corp.com/media/Market...tionmanual.pdf

Welwynnick

Yeah, they're all in this thread. The WP29 is the daddy. Flow and pressure.



Nick

Mackhack

Thanks to both of you guys!

MB-CLS500

what do you guys think about this 12v to 24v converter ?

Welwynnick

More flow always helps. You can never have too much.

However, flow costs, and the power needed to increase flow goes up exponentially.

And after a while you get to the point of diminishing returns, where the coolant temp hardly changes around the circuit.

I don't think we're close to that with the stock V12 system though - I think it's marginal as it is.

Nick

ZephTheChef

I am looking at the PDF. Page 14 has the voltage requirements. The 12V pump is 9-16V input, and the 24V pump is 18-32V input. Where you were seeing the pumps at 14v and 28v is on the flow chart page 9. Those charts are representative of the 12V pump at 14V, and the 24V pump at 28V.

I do not think they would bother to make distinctly separate 12V and 24V pumps if it was truly completely flexible on voltage.

Mackhack

I'm not familiar with the pump but if they offer one for 24V systems I'd say it's for trucks and boats that actually run on 24vDC.

I don't wanna belittle someone's 24v project but I would think its not worth it if you have to step up the 12v that is on board to get enough juice flowing for this pump. Most likely I'm wrong but def. interested in the outcome of the brave ones here.

Welwynnick

A DC inverter like that would work, but you'd need a more powerful one for the EMP pump, which is very current-hungry.

Nick

ZephTheChef

Agreed. I was just saying more flow doesn't do you any good if your system is heatsoaked. It does no good to flow the same water through the exchanger/intercoolers 25x a minute if the heat exchanger can't keep up with the heat the intercoolers are putting into the water. So everything really needs to be upgraded together. Or at least heat exchanger or system capacity (with a large reservoir). It's different if you're flowing 25gpm and you have 10 gallons in the system. The cores will always be seeing fresh water that hasn't been heated during a normal stretch of acceleration that way, so the heat exchanger capacity is irrelevent, it only comes into play off-boost and is allowed to recover/dissipate that heat over a longer time period.

But of course, who has room for or wants to carry around an extra 80 lbs of water?

Crissus

In german Motor-Talk Forums, someone flow-tested the CWA-100 Pump by Pierburg. He used a real inline flow-meter with "impulses/second" and he has an E55AMG with additional HE. He measured after the HE and he found that the CWA-100 flows 30% faster than the Bosch 010 pump. He was disappointed by that result, however if you look at that tiny CWA-100 pump compared to all the others, its immpressive i personally think.