Hello,

I've never owned a Merc. Let me say that up front. I'm an American sports car guy- I currently own a Corvette. But I got married last year for the first time (I'm 39), and we just had a baby. Corvette and baby don't mix.

My wife's dream is to own a Mercedes. We don't know anything about them, so I've spent the last three months reading up on the various models. But we can't afford anything new ($20k max is the budget), so we've been looking at the used market.

What we've narrowed it down to is either a 2000-2002 S-Class, or 2003-2004 E class. They both are beautiful cars. I realize the older S-Class is a model behind and the 2003+ E-class is still current as of today. What I want to know is, which is a better fit for us?

I like power, but I know the S is heavy, so I was looking at a E-500. She likes luxury, and short of a mega buck car, it's hard to beat an S. But I don't want a lead sled. I know I'm not going to get Corvette performance either way, and I can't afford an AMG or 600, so I'll probably have to just bite the bullet.

So, in all of your opinions, should I get a S500 or S430? Or a newer E? Thanks!

 

I suggest you test drive both, and try to find an ABC equipped S500. I think you'll find the handling of the ABC S to be more agile than the Airmatic E.

Weight aside (which is more than made up for if you compare an S500 and E320, let's say) there is no comparison in comfort, luxury, fit and finish and technology. A 400-mile drive in an S is not tiring for driver or passenger. Think first-class cabin versus business class.

As for current vs. non-current model: don't forget that much MB technology starts is introduced in the S class and then follow into other models in a couple of years. In other words, as far as currency of technology, the W220 is not behind the W211. If you don't like the idea of driving a model that has been replaced, it's more of an emotional issue and you have to decide for yourself. A less emotional analysis might note that the W220 has already taken the hit on value when the W221 came out (which is good for a buyer) while the W211 hasn't (which is bad for a buyer who might become a seller after the new E is introduced).

 

Great input. Thank you. I'm leaning towards an S500 now. How's the gas mileage on these cars? Believe it or not, my Corvette gets 32 mpg highway because of the 6 speed (it runs at 1300 rpm at 70mph). I live in Connecticut, but travel back to Ohio every couple months to visit friends and family.

It might be nice to go from a car that will rattle you teeth loose over a less than perfect road to an S class. I just am afraid that I'll miss the performance. To be honest, that's the only reason the E-class was in the running.

Thanks again.

 

I've owned two W220s, an S55 and my current S65 so I can't give you relevant mileage experience. I will say that when I moved from my W140 S500 to the W220 S55 my mileage improved considerably. Others will have to weigh in on their actuals. I will say that if you can possibly stretch your budget to a 2004, that was the first year with the 7-speed transmission, which does improve things by a couple of MPG. It also has a much improved fiber optic bus (latest technology) that bumps you to DVD nav (as opposed to CD-based in 200-2003). The nav is much improved in other ways and the new system has a much, much better phone integration including the ability to use several different phone "cradles" as well as Bluetooth. The phone integration for 2004 also includes a much improved voice control system that lets you route by saying city names and spelling out streets. Hands-free nav is pretty cool. Keep in mind that the phone integration with voice control is an option, but it can be added by any dealer for about $1,500 if your car doesn't have it. It feels like a million when you use it, though. There are a few cosmetic differences between 2002 and 2004 as well. For the emotional side, nobody can tell that your 2004 isn't a 2006. All told, it's a 2004 S500 with ABC ftw.

 

I have both a Camaro and a S430 and they're on opposites sides of the universe when it comes to feel. I know Corvettes are a lot nicer than Camaros, but both cars share the exact same engine (LS1s...wait do you have a C5 or C6?).

Even a AMG Benz will not be nearly as brutal as a GM sports car when it comes to driving experience. I advise you look to 2003+ S-classes and stay away from the earlier models like my 2000, but either way, you wouldn't be disappointed by the comfort the car provides. And it you have a lead foot, the car can be fun in its own right.

 

Do you have to sell your Corvette? I bought my Carrera before I met my wife knowing that she couldn't make me get rid of it. Glad I did b/c she hates sports cars. She loves big cars.

Which leads me to the 2003 S430. She loves it. I liked the E, but the car was more for her. Is the car more for you or her? Our S get 21mpg.

Did you know the E-class is completely redesigned in 1yr?
So both cars won't look like current models by time you start driving it anyways.

I've driven both and like the E more, but my wife is very glad we decided on the S. The E felt a little more sporty, which I like.
I have since come to appreciate the S-class looks, poise, status, elegance.
No car says you've arrived like an S-class.
Good luck. You can't go wrong with either cars

 

Wow, thanks guys.

It's a C6. Yes, 425 hp with only 3100 pounds will be hard to replicate with either Merc.

The problem is that I just moved to the Greenwich/Stamford area of Connecticut, which is in the top 3 for most expensive places to live in the US, so we can't afford to keep the Corvette and buy a Mercedes. I'm paying enough for rent to buy a $500k home back where I'm from in Ohio, so we have to watch our wallet. Keeping the Vette is out of the question because I just had a baby, and you can't put a baby in a 2 seater. Not only that, but I have to pay $120/mo for another parking space at my complex!

I'm leaning towards an S, even though I think I'd personally be happier with an E. There's a Merc dealer down the road a ways (in between the Lamborghini, Ferrari, Porche, Bentley, and Rolls Royce dealers), but they only have new cars. They have a whole fleet of those Maybachs, or however you spell them. That's one ugly car imo. I have no idea what they do with their trade ins. There has to be tons of trade ins because this area of the country is so filled with German machinery, you can't look 10 feet without seeing a Merc, BMW, or Audi.

Anyway, I digress. Thank you guys so much for your opinions. I really appreciate it.

 

i still miss our 2002 E320,that car was so perfect in so many ways.we saw 31 mpg on the highway going to san diego at 80 mph with the ac on.it had just enough gadgets to be comfortable but bare enough to be reliable.The S platform is a beautiful car in every way "but" you cant really be on a budget to own one outside warranty.you can get a beautiful E class for 20k and that car will either hook you on MB or let you off easy.S class cars are designed to pamper the wealthy,iv'e seen to many situations where someone gets one thinking they are a pillar of reliability only to find out that there is definitly a heavy cost of ownership above and beyond the purchase price.the E class will pamper your wife,be safer than any american automobile and have enough bling to encourage you to keep it looking it's best.

 

If you buy a sub 20k 220, you will need to put about 10k away for repairs.

trust me, It will happen.

 

Ouch. Wow. Ok, so no S class. I definitely don't want to spend $10k for repairs. So the 2003 E class is the one to buy? Is this opinion about the S-class universal, or just one man's opinion?

 

Don't believe everything people say on here as law!!!

I am at 90K on my 2004 since two years and have driven the hell out of it.

I don;t have an extended warranty, and my out of pocket since I have owned the car is less than 1500 not including mods nd regular stuff like oil changes, brakes, etc.. You just can't beat that!.

The trick with the 220 and any car is to get it with some of the factory warranty left, and get every nook and cranny fixed while it is covered.
I've done that with th X5 also and they have done a ton of free work for me already and the warranty is good till next april. I bought that car for less than trade value.

I have owned a 2004 E class and now I own a 2004 S class.. Both are great cars, but I'll take the S over the E in luxury and wowfactor any day... The E was a bit smaller so I had more fun bending corners in it, but they are two different cars...

My E was under warranty the entire time I had it so I paid for nothing except my NAV retrofit and the Eibach springs, and other mod stuffs...

IF you et a 220 get a least an 04 because of the DVD and all of the upgrades from 2000-2002 models.2003 is fine but it diesnlt come with dvd.

If you get an E class get at least an 04 because of the DVD Nav and the bugs gone from the 03 body style change.

 

If you only have $20K for a car, you are going to need to plan for repairs. Its just a fact of life.

If the car is for her, start looking at 320's. I doubt that she will care that it doesn't have the big motor. It will get better milage, and will cost less whether an E or an S.

 

i did encourage the E class but i drive the 2003 S500 and will never go any direction but up to the S600 biturbo.we also have a extremely reliable S500,i do 100% of all scheduled maintanance.the car is still covered for another 18 months of factory extended warranty and has 52k on the odometer.if you buy the E and like it,you are gonna end up upgrading to the S.your budget of 20k is a little low for the S,and you absolutely dont want to buy a low dollar S only to find out it has mechanical/electronic issues.i still say $35k is the magic #.im biased,my advice is to call MB of escondido ca,Fletcher jones in newport beach ca.tell them you can spend $35k and to call you when a great car comes in on trade.get a $350 one way flight and enjoy the ride back home.California has no road salt issues,very little rain and a huge cult like group of society that buy new MB's and trade in their old ones like the economy has never been better.

 

honestly, I wouldn't buy a 2003/04 Eclass either. They have their own issues.

You might want to look at a 210 eclass (up to 02). Classic MB looks, reliable for the most part, and a very solid feeling car. 20k will get you a pristine example.

 

I'll throw in my 2 cents. If you can find the money to get into an '04 or newer S-class you'll never regret it. It is true the '00-'03 cars (not so much the '03) have expensive troubles with suspension and electronics, but the '04 and later are super. In '04 you got the 7-speed transmission which means I get 27-29 mpg at interstate speeds and I'm averaging 21-22 in mixed driving. The E-class is a fine car, and you won't regret having one but it isn't the flagship of the line. I've driven four hours without a stop and never known it. The room and comfort for passengers (the new baby)--not to mention the steel billet safety--is another plus. This is my first S, and I've had E's. Find the pennies. The S-class is the benchmark for every other automobile on the road. You don't hear people say "It's almost as good as a Lexus." It's the S-class they're talking about when they say "It's almost as good as a Mercedes."

 

Ok, thanks for the input. I really appreciate it.

However, $20k is the limit, and we honestly cannot go over it. If it takes $35k to get a prime example, I'll go buy something else.

I was going to get a C class, but my wife thinks that it is too small. She crossed it off the list at first site.

Here's what I don't get. I remember back in the 1980s when Merc used to advertise reliability as being the prime reason for owning a Mercedes. 500k miles and still going was the commercial. The reason I bring this up is the fact that I found a 2000 S class yesterday at a Merc dealer down the road. It is beautiful- perfect inside and out, but it has 135k miles on it. Everyone I talk to says don't buy it, way too many miles for an S. It's about to fall apart.

Why? No car built today should fall apart at 135,000 miles. My beater car, an '03 Grand Prix, has 138k miles, and it runs and performs perfectly. My old Bonneville SSEi had 225k miles when I sold it, and it was perfect as well- and it's still going 6 years later. I had a Buick Century that had over 280k miles with no problems. Yes, I had my nice cars with no miles for weekend cruising, but my work cars have always been very nice high mileage cars and I never spent any money on them. Once, on my Bonneville at about 190,000 miles, I had to put a new harmonic balancer on it, which cost about $100 and 6 hours of my time, but that's to be expected. Why would the Mercedes flagship car require tens of thousands in repairs once they hit 50k miles or so? I don't get it.

It reminds me of a friend who bought a Murcielago 3 years ago. He drove it until it hit 7000 miles and then put it up for sale at a huge loss. I asked him why, and he said, "Once these cars hit about 10k miles, they need a complete engine overhaul." What?! $400k for a car and you have to overhaul it every 10k miles? That's ridiculous! You can buy a ZR-1 Corvette with the same power and it will run 10 or 20 times as long.

Why would anyone buy a car knowing that it will fall apart when it's barely broken in? Lambo or Merc?

Sorry, I'm just a little frustrated. I needed to vent.

 

A 2000 S-class with 135,000 miles will not fall apart. However, the odds are that it will suffer from suspension or electrical component problems in the future.

In the '80s, Mercedes were bullet proof because they were simpler. The W126 1990 420SEL cost more in inflation-adjusted dollars than a W221 2009 S550, but had neither Airmatic nor ABC suspension, had a 2-valve (not 3 or 4) SOHC (not DOHC) engine that delivered 228 HP (not 382), a four-speed (not seven) transmission and didn't have ABC, BAS, ESP, COMAND with GPS navigation and much better audio with CD changer, memory mirrors, bi-xenon headlights, tight voice-control integration, Smartkey, garage opener, Teleaid, ambient lighting, cluster display, multi-function steering wheel controls, easy entry options, dual-zone climate control, 15-way seats, pre-safe, air curtains and TPMS.

Even in the W221, these goodies add a tremendous amount of complexity and will cause failures that would not happen if there were not part of the design. But they are all second-generation now and more reliable than the first-generation versions on the W220.

That said, the 2000 was the first year and after 135,000 miles many of the original problematic components have probably failed and replaced with later versions by earlier owners. But there is no doubt that an old W220 without warranty is a gamble.

 

To echo what Whoover said, a 120k mile 220 is not about to fall apart. However, like any car, it will need repairs.

The s500 originally cost about 90k with a few options. Given the level of comfort and options, some of the parts and repairs will be expensive if you are coming from the perspective of a typical $28k GM sedan. However, given the repair/msrp ratio, they are simply not outrageous.

Think about it this way: Since these cars have such poor resale value, you are getting a $90k vehicle for $20k. Aside from some miles, nothing is inherently different about the car. If you spend that $10k on repairs, you end up with an almost perfect car for a whopping $60,000 discount.

To me, I don't care about the market value of the car. I would spend $10k fixing things because it is worth it to me, because I love the way the car looks and drives. Considering that a new S550 would lose about $15k in value in the first year (at least), Id say Im coming out ahead, even with some repairs.

Bottomline, its was an expensive luxury car when it was new. Now its still a top notch luxury car, and the discount you get in the purchase price is made up in repairs. You have to pay to play one way or another.

 

these cars are everything you percieve them to be,the S will give you a feeling of success and pride of ownership.it will keep you and your family safer and more comfortable than any american auto could ever "luck" their way into.if 20k is your budget and it sounds like you are sticking to it,than ask the local MB dealer to call when they have a deal with a client that has a trade that the dealer is forced to wholsale based upon age,they cant warranty anything older than 4 model years reguardless of condition/mileage.if they have your # in their back pocket and can help the client trying to buy the new benz by you buying the trade at a more realistic price than "wholsale horror" than everyone is happy.you can end up with a truly pampered car for the $20k.whatever you get,"HAVE IT INSPECTED BY A DEALER,GET A CARFAX,AND HAVE THE DEALER RUN THE VIN # TO DETERMINE ALL DOCUMENTED MAINTENANCE,COMPLAINTS,REPAIRS.you may be able to work all these requests into the deal at no cost to you if the dealer is motivated.

 

Unfortunately, there is some truth to this. So the fiscally responsible thing to do may be to avoid a Merc for now, given the inevitable expenses of baby, relocation, etc. (unless you can find a CPO or otherwise warrantied example within your budget).

 

Thanks guys. I drove it today. Very nice. Everything works, but there are 3 bulbs out and it needs its washer resevoir filled. It's a 430, not a 500, but fairly peppy. It'll run with my Pontiac, and certainly rides a ton better. To be honest, I wasn't terribly impressed with the seat comfort- though I'll admit I have no idea how to properly adjust the seat. Right now it is set up a bit too firm for my taste.

I think I can get it for about $8000. Even with $10,000 in repairs, I'm still at $18,000- well within my budget. The only thing that was of any concern was the driver seat and center console cover were showing wear (it has 138,000 miles, so that's to be expected), and the little dial control on the seat corner, or the plastic around it, is cracked. I hate to imagine how much that would cost. It is a very pretty blue, but not Merc blue. It passed the carfax report, but the paint isn't original so somewhere along the line it was repainted a new color. It's medium blue metalic pearl, the exacty same paint they put on Honda VTX motorcycles that looks deep purple in the dark, and bright blue in the sunlight. It's really beautiful if you like those colors.

He did say that the break pads were going to need replacing soon. The car's computer isn't alerting about it (I'm assuming it's capable of that), but the break pedal does have about 3 inches of travel. The funny thing is they had just armor all'ed the engine, and during our drive it started smoking the most aweful smelling smoke. The sales guy was visibly shaken, but I knew what the deal was with over armor all'ing an engine.

I have a couple days left to decide. He has another buyer, but I put a small refundable deposite on it so he would hold it for me while we decide. I'm the type of guy who fixes my own cars, so I'm a little afraid of the thing. Right now I'm looking to see how much spare parts cost, and how available they are to the average weekend novice mehcanic like myself. I'll let you all know what we decide.

Thanks so much for all your input. We really apprecaite it.

 

"keep looking".based upon your threads i do percieve you as a driver with mechanical sense and the knowledge to keep a car running and the skill and common sense to keep from destroying it.you deserve a factory original car in every way possible.they are out there,i dont want to discourage you but the fact that it has been repainted a non factory color takes away from the class/elegance.id rather have a 10 year old car with a couple of door dings and some front end pitting with original paint.you are a sought after comodity in that you are looking to buy a 10-20 thousand dollar pre owned car.call other dealerships and keep looking.

 

last year we sold our 2002 E320 with 66k miles that was flawless in every way for $17,000.i know you want the S and you can find a nice one if you are patient.

 

you do not want an $8,000 S class.

there is a reason the car would be sold that cheap.