trumpet1

I took my S600 to a non-MB shop today to ponder about upcoming services. My nearest MB shop/dealer is 20 miles away and but there is an independent MB shop only 6 blocks away from my house that is operated by a mechanic who once worked for my local MB shop for 20 years and branched out on his own a few years ago. In fact, I remember his name from the past.

He told me to ditch my S600 at the end of the warranty because he said I will have terrible problems with it afterwards. The whole statement began when I said how little trouble I've had with my car. He said that I've just been lucky but to get rid of 'er before the 50,000 mile mark.

He said MB just can't seem to get things right with their V12's.

Does anyone know of this big of a problem with the V12s??? I asked him about the V8's and he said they are far better and no big problems usually pop up. He also said to forget about the 10K+ miles between oil changes and that I should get it changed every 6K miles or I will have oil leaks and oil burning problems really soon. He said if I leased it, don't worry about it but if I purchased it and plan on keeping it that I'd better get the oil changed electively at least every 6K miles.

Gondon

Maybe he is talking about to 2000-2002 V12's?

I know the BI-Turbos are more reliable.

ahmadkshuja

I really hope not. I purchased mine; it is not leased.

WSH

Would get rid of any car before warranty period ends....

New S-Classes are world's most complex cars, w/numerous, expensive, new-tech computer systems, advanced headlights, safety systems, etc...no one really knows what are decay curves of the various systems, esp after original factory warranty...it's an on-going science experiment...

Human risk of various cardiovasc/cancer health issues increases dramatically after age ?45...suspect cars have a similar risk curve post-some age/amt of use...

Also would calc value of one's time to take any car to dealer for svc/repairs (warranty or not)...suspect most 600 owners' time is rather valuable....

And suspect decay of various airbag sensors/systems, seatbelts, DistPlus, etc makes >3yo cars less safe over time (a 4-5yo 600 might be as unsafe as a new Lexus/BMW)...airbag systems have a ?10 yr lifespan; doubt they suddenly die 10yrs post-build...would guess the failure rate of airbags/seatbelts, etc quickly increases after 3-4yrs post-build....

Ferri

Categorical verdicts like that based on outdated experience are not too accurate. To assume that there is absolutely no learning curve for a company like MB is a rushed and un-based conclusion.

trumpet1

I asked him if he was referring to the ones that had the cylinder bank shut off and he did seem to infer that they were the problems but he was saying they were only 2 years ago. That's not true as the W221 and late W220 engines are similar if I'm not mistaken and none of them have the shut off feature do they???

Just my feeling but I think he blew this way out of proportion. If one takes care of the cars as I do, I don't see where they would give any more trouble than any other car. I don't dog my car and I pamper the hell out of it.

trumpet1

In one way I thoroughly agree with you but I don't have the discretionary income to lose $70K every two years on a car. I would like to at least own the car to the point that what I owe on it equals what I can get for it. Best thing for me to consider next time is a lease since I only go about 15K miles /year on a car.

Could you post average payments on a S600 for a 24 to 39 month lease??? This definitely will be my next approach at taking one of the lot next time. It's just I love the car I have and really have no desire for a new one since its been faithful to me so far.

Mercutio.Mont

None of the MY2007 S600's have been on the road for four years yet. At least not in the US.

That said, I wouldn't own any modern non-Japanese built Toyota after the warranty expires.

451/443=EW

Iv been talking to MB tecs too and they have told me anything after 06 is awsome. They say that 05 and older is all they have issues with. So I said well these 06 and up are still quite new. They told me that even when the older cars were quite new they still saw them in the shops. Bottom line I think that this guy is blowing it way out of proportion.

newton22

I would not keep a post-1998 Mercedes-Benz after warranty PERIOD.

Satan

Sorry to hear that considering toyota is not rated #1 in anything.

AsianML

This engine has been out since 2002.

cjf_moraga

--

Even though this place is just a few blocks away, your S600 is still pretty new and well inside warranty. In your position I would never even consider having such a car serviced by a non-MB dealer. (And 20 miles is hardly a chore to drive in your S600! - my dealer would come that far to pick my car up or offer me a loaner)

Anyway, based on the (many) threads I have read concerning M275 V12 reliability I also believe that this individual is basing his comments on the older M137 V12 and is blowing things way out of proportion. (Which had only a short 3 years life after the older M120 V12 was phased out. (That rapid product cycling perhaps being the source of his "can't get things right" statement)

This is a non-MB shop mechanic who branched out on his own several years ago. I doubt that he has seen many/any more recent M275 TT V12's as few owners will take their new vehicles to a non-MB dealer outside of the 4 year warranty period. His substantive experience is likely not going to be any later than the 2002 - 2004 period - when there were recognized issues with the older M137 V12.

And even if he has personally encountered some problems with more recent engines he represents an exceedingly small statistical data point. If there were really problems with the post 2002 V12 TT of the magnitude he describes we would surely be hearing about it in the far larger sampling of this website - and I can recall few if any comments. (I read the w220 forum also) The later M275 V12's seem pretty solid if driven properly and serviced regularly. Some have pointed out that the current 3-valve M275 is an "older" engine design and it is - but that also means it must be pretty well understood by now and has benefitted from incremental improvements in each model year based on real world service experience. I have few fears, and even if I did extending the warranty to 7 years buys more peace of mind,

I have also had the oil change discussion with my SA (several times) and he insists that 10,000 miles is fine for the current S600. Again surely given the sample size of owners represented on this board (and Benzworld) we would surely be hearing about more problems if they were occurring with any meaningful statistical regularity.

Chris

Diesel Benz

I fully agree with this guy, as long as you sell the car cheap to me when you get rid of it.

Funny how these opinions appear even among people who have reasonable experience about cars. I guess 90% are just jealous (a good reason to be jealous but it should be OK to show it in a positive way), the rest perhaps mistakenly refer to some old info that isn't valid for this model.

Untertürkheim

This guy does not know what he is talking about, although I would still buy the 100k mile warranty from MB if I kept a car past 50k.

trumpet1

That's pretty much how I felt about things but I guess I needed to hear it from you all as confirmation. You're right, I think if there were problems with it, this forum would have been full radar ahead of notification. I don't believe he has probably touched a V12 in a few years so probably will just go back to my dealership from here on.

AntonioDestiny

I would never keep a Benz out of warranty unless you like to look at service invoices or unless it was a speciality car like the Gullwing or CLK-GTR etc etc.

Ferri

I remember a few months back, as I was changing the oill on my SL, and was inquiring about the 221, the SA had only good things to say about it. And he was sure to add that every MB mechanic he has worked with or he knows of hated--absolutely hated--the 220 for their entire run.

MBUSAFLY9

warranty mate !

carsnob

I had a chat with a MB roadside assistance guy a while back and he said that there were just no problems at all with these new S class models. He was astonished at how amazing these cars are (550's or 600's).
I bought my S 600 as a "keeper" as I've had so many Mercedes S class cars.
Now I've finaly got every frickin option and love this car. Given Mercedes' history, I'd bet that this car will be quite fine well out of the warranty period.
You see a lot more old, old Mercedes on the road -- more than any other car.
Even very used Bimmers are fewer and farther between than MB's.
Hence, I too will be planning to save the 70 g's or so every couple of years and enjoy my car for a long long time, while other manufacturers will be trying to catch up with the quality, options and handling of this very fine vehicle for years to come. btw, that mechanic seems to have a chip on his shoulder and seems way off base... As for WSH, dealers love you so keep them happy...

trumpet1

Thanks for the replies and I don't feel so bad about things after hearing such positive input.

tomd

Similar experience at my local dealer. I asked my longtime salesman about the SL55 vs SL600. He directed me to the service manager who told me to RUN away from any 600 car. He further said that, at any given time, 10% of these cars were in the shop.

He had no dog in this fight.

I basically agree with some of the other posters. I would not want to own any MB out of warranty, especially any 600 series.

Quadcammer

This may not be a popular opinion, but I also think some of the appeal of having an S-Class is having the NEW S-Class. If they come out with a revised or entirely new model in say 4 or 5 years, do you really want to have the outdated model? I didn't feel like spending $70k on a car I put 4k miles on a year, so I went with a much cheaper 220, but If I used it a lot, Id lease a new one and get a new one every couple of years.

vonbeeler

I wouldn't worry about it. If there are any issues general they would be discovered in the first 50k miles. After that the car should be reliable to 75k or more. Keep in perspective that depreciation is our biggest expense and as the years go it lessens dramatically. Even if there was a major mechanical issue I'm sure $5k would cover it. Pretty insignificant considering the depreciation was $100k in the first four years. I plan to keep mine until the new model arrivies. There simply is no better auto available from performance and looks departments. BTW I've never kept a vehicle more than 3 years (last S) and typically in the past when I was younger I would trade exotics every 12mos. I've become wiser to keep cars longer and the biggest benefit to wanting to trade this car is there really isn't anything worth trading to! Forcing me to keep longer I would't let reliability concern (minimal potential expense) force you to purchase new (major depriciation expense) until you find a new car you want.

AustinGuy

The W221 has been out for 2 years now. Plenty of time for problems to show up. Not near enough time for MB techs to make dire predictions.

Based on these facts, I'd conclude that the W221 (S550's and S600's) are very nice, trouble free cars.



Enjoy.