Raven2021

Greetings all!

I am a prospective R230 SL600 or SL65 AMG (depends on price and availability of a nice example of either) and have some (literally a few) questions. To preface, I am not a "newb" when it comes to performance vehicles nor am I novice in the realm of Automotive engineering so feel free to lay terminology upon the mantle of the internet.

That said: In my quest for a 'right example' of a clean Mercedes R230 SL600 V12 biturbo or SL65 AMG....I am wondering (as cross referencing has not answered this) what the differences are between the two meaning; shorthand: Am I missing out on a totally different vehicle with the SL65 AMG in purchasing the SL600 and if so in what way(s)? I realize the bodies are different aesthetically for the sake of aerodynamics which does make me wonder if the body being the way it is on an SL65 AMG is necessary to SAFELY do the upper speeds it is known of being capable of? The engine on the SL65 is bigger, obviously but are components different? Is the intercooler, for instance different to cope with the increase of IATs in the engine being of a larger internal capacity? Is the software of an SL65 AMG different and again; if so, in what way(s)? Are time tables that much different? Is injector load and ignition vastly different? The SL600's automatic gearbox is a 5 speed where-as the SL65s is a six? Is this correct? Is the extra gear worth it?

My other question is....In researching replacement parts for an SL600 and / or SL65 AMG I notice there are no sway bars or sway bar components (end links) listed on any site except for pelicanparts.com which lists them for "any vehicle but code 487). I have read Code: 487 as being an indicator of ABS suspension. Is this correct and if so; Does this also mean the ABS suspension acts as the stabilization which otherwise would be carried out by traditional sway bars? If so....That's freaking awesome!! The same technology recently has been applied to the P1 by MaClaren.

I really have no other questions more just a world of anxiety until I get my hands on a clean SL600 or SL65 AMG!!

I am making the leap from being a HARDCORE BMW enthusiast for a long time as well as VW / Audi 'tuner' and enthusiast for a long time. I am still, from time to time, tempted to stick to my VW / Audi roots and purchase a 911 considering their retail value used is tremendously low right now but I like trying new things and the prospect of ignition coils and a $7,500.00 suspension system don't really scare me.

Rudeney

Regarding the anti-sway bars, these cars have an ABNC (active body control) suspension that uses a high-pressure pump and a system of valve to adjust the hydraulic pressure in the shocks. It can do this individually and can make the car corner flatly. Because of this, anti-sway bars are unnecessary. This system comes at a cost - it's complex and prone to failure. Most people just consider the parts that fail to be normal maintenance issues. Expect to average $1K/year on ABC "maintenance".

ItalianJoe1

600-65 differences are fairly minor. The engine is a half-liter bigger, the turbos are larger and the heat exchanger is bigger, but otherwise they are the same. Same transmission. Tuning is similar, the 65 runs more boost from factory, so gains from tuning are greater on the 600 than a 65.

The 600 is the bargain steal, they are usually half the price of a 65 for 90% of the car. I'd much rather have a nice clean 600 than a rough 65.

As far as the suspension and coils, most of the fear-mongering is by uninformed people and non-owners. Yes the coils are expensive when they fail, but if replacing the coils once after 15 years is going to deter you from buying a car like this, it isn't for you. It's not like they go out every year.

The suspension system, is great when it works, and it normally is very solid if properly maintained. The issue is, the factory does not specify any maintenance, so people wait until it breaks, then it gets expensive. Regular inspection for leaks, fluid changes every couple years, and it will also last a long time. There is a TON of good info out there on this forum about it.

I recently suffered from a neglected system that failed on my car, and while it was expensive (almost 2k in parts), I was the first one to ever work on the system, in a car from 2003. If the parts last me another 15 years, with zero maintenance, i'm perfectly ok with that. I will do what I can to prolong the life but again, the system doesn't just explode at random. It will give you warnings, and if ignored, will usually fail mildly enough that the car will even remain drivable enough to make it a reasonable distance home/to the shop. Should not be a deterrent when getting a car that's this much value for the money.

Raven2021

Thanks for the replies! Apologies for the misprint: "spective owner....".

I understand the differences now and appreciate that. Part of me thinks an SL65 AMG is worth the extra money but that is in no way to take away from the awesomeness of an SL600.

I will scour this forum and read as much as I can!

Thanks again and does anyone ever make it out to H20i in Ocean City by chance? Are there any yearly meets comparable to say a 'Bimmerfest East'?

Thanks again!

tandan

The 911 cabriolet was my ex's dream car, so I bought a 1990 and drove it for 7 years. In 2005 my ex fell in love with a SL500 so I bought an SL600. In 2015, I entered my second childhood and bought myself an SL65. The porsche was a fun car. I am told my time from San Diego to San Felipe was not possible, but it was a fun drive. As a daily driver, I did not like it. The 600 was night and day better as a daily driver. It was smooth, sleek fast and I loved it. The only major expense was 2 coils at $3500 each failing at about 70,000 miles. I did not have ABC problems. At 85,000 miles, I traded it for the 65. Do not get me wrong, I loved the 600 and was thinking about tuning it for another 100 hp, but the 65 is an altogether different experience. It is not only more powerful,but somehow feels more solid and planted to the road. I am glad I made the step up. I did have to replace the ABC pump ($5000) at 39,000 miles, so there is that.

Raven2021

Thank you for the very well stated response! Keep these responses coming guys.

This is my thought that the 65 is worth holding out for. Upgrading a 600 with modification(s) is the very point I am kind of making. The larger turbochargers on the 65, upgraded cooling and 'more planted' feeling (probably mostly attributed to the aerodynamics of the full AMG package and additional weight) are what are weighing on my mind. I'm sure it's fine either way and again a 600 is by no means - what-so-ever a "slouch" and I would never denigrate it's badge by even implying such a thing but the 65 does play on your mind like: "Is it worth it?". It's like owning a 328i always wondering what an ///M3 would be like. Thank you for the input again but I think ultimately the decision will come down to a 600 being the maintenance is nearly identical on the two with the coil packs, ABC and other associated sensors etc.... The increase in power from the factory (without having to purchase a tune) would be nice but I take everyone's word for it that the 600, as stated by ItalianJoe1, is 90% the vehicle a 65 is for half the price which is very VERY true.

Rudeney

One of things you will get on the SL65 is the AMG-tuned speed shift transmission. It makes a huge difference in perceived performance.

carguyshu

There are over 100 part number differences between a 600 & 65. While they both have the a 5 speed transmission the 65 version is more robust with upgraded components like different clutch packs. Also has larger axels out back. The brakes are significantly better on the 65, but rotors are a lot more expensive. The ABC suspension is more aggressively tuned on the 65 too. Given that the maintenance between both are going to be the same (& not cheap) I don't see any reason to settle for a 600. In hindsight I wish I hadn't bought my 55 & gotten a 65 instead. I'm so upside down in the 55 & have done so much preventative maintenance at this point it's not worth taking the massive hit & switching.

ItalianJoe1

It's not the maintenacen cost that's a killer, it's the initial cost.

My 2003 CL600, super clean, loaded, black on black, 74k miles. Bought it for $13k. A similar condition '05 CL65? $35k.

Is the 65 a better car? Absolutely. Is it worth the price of THREE of my cars? No ****ing way.

carguyshu

On an SL you're only looking at a 10k difference between the 2

ItalianJoe1

True, the SL commands a premium over the CL/S in the 600 series, but the 65 is similar in all body styles. S classes are always cheaper though.

ifessup

I purchased a 2005 SL65 this past year and totally love it. I was actually planing on a 911 for about the same price but I couldn't really find one that I loved. I started looking at other cars and after one drive in the SL65 there was no comparison. The 65 has so much torque and feels like so much more of a car. Unfortunately I have never driven a SL600 so I can't give you a comparison.

To date I have changed fluids and now have one shock with a leak so I will be replacing it this winter. I bought the car with 34K miles and put on 7000 in the last 7 months. The car puts a big smile on my face every time I jump in for a drive.

Good luck on your search.
Ian

gary1944

I own a 2004 SL600 with approx. 78k miles. The main thing to look for is if there is deferred maintenance. These cars need proper maintenance and with reasonable care are the bargain of the year. Stay away from one that has had a LOT of issues. My experience has been that some of these always have issues but many , such as mine, just need attention and proper maintenance.


I have owned a lot of high performance cars ( Porsche Carrera, Corvette Z06, BMW M3, Hemi Roadrunner, etc.etc.) and I have to say that the SL600 is my favorite. Even around here in car crazy California you just don't see too many of these and for me , that makes it even better. Who wants want everyone else has ???

okbarnett

Easy come, Easy go. Nobody said buying cars was a money making endeavor. You should buy a car because you want the car.