Supercharger for AMG 63s (M156)
05-26-2008, 11:54 AM
#152
Why would you go to the trouble of developing a new manifold for a 63 Kenne Bell system that will be significantly limited without changing the engine internals and lowering compression when you could do the same thing for the 55K cars that are already set up for FI? And not to mention the fact that there are many, many more of the 55K cars on the road already, and with bargain basement prices on a lot of them the market for the systems would be far larger. It's been apparent for several years that the major limitation on getting more power out of the 55K engine is the factory supercharger, and I do not understand why someone hasn't engineered a replacement blower for it that can move more air (and a KB would be a great choice).
05-26-2008, 12:19 PM
#153
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S600TT, R350
Why would you go to the trouble of developing a new manifold for a 63 Kenne Bell system that will be significantly limited without changing the engine internals and lowering compression
I do not understand why someone hasn't engineered a replacement blower for it that can move more air (and a KB would be a great choice).
05-26-2008, 09:37 PM
#156
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Why would you go to the trouble of developing a new manifold for a 63 Kenne Bell system that will be significantly limited without changing the engine internals and lowering compression when you could do the same thing for the 55K cars that are already set up for FI? And not to mention the fact that there are many, many more of the 55K cars on the road already, and with bargain basement prices on a lot of them the market for the systems would be far larger. It's been apparent for several years that the major limitation on getting more power out of the 55K engine is the factory supercharger, and I do not understand why someone hasn't engineered a replacement blower for it that can move more air (and a KB would be a great choice).
05-26-2008, 10:17 PM
#157
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please super charge me I cannot take being the 2nd fastest CLS in the USA, I will VRP wrap my ride, HELP ME DR. SPOK.........
How fast would my car be if im doing 12.1@116.5? HELP , HELP , HELP..
How fast would my car be if im doing 12.1@116.5? HELP , HELP , HELP..
05-28-2008, 09:16 PM
#158
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V12-Biturbo
But if you opt for a high boost w/lower compression, I would easily imagine 150+ rwhp & poss high 10's w/traction of course.
Last edited by Thericker; 05-28-2008 at 09:20 PM.
05-29-2008, 08:02 PM
#159
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E55, GLS450, GL63, GLE350
Assuming he is making around 420 RWHP stock, he'll get 80 to 80 RWHP if he is only running 3 PSI. 5 PSI should net around 140+ RWHP with an effective intercooler. 7.35 psi should get your around 50% more power and 14.7 PSI should double the stock power assuming everything else equal. I don't think the stock motor could take 1 bar of boost but it should be able to take 5 to 7 psi with good cooling and a proper tune.
05-30-2008, 05:57 AM
#160
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Assuming he is making around 420 RWHP stock, he'll get 80 to 80 RWHP if he is only running 3 PSI. 5 PSI should net around 140+ RWHP with an effective intercooler. 7.35 psi should get your around 50% more power and 14.7 PSI should double the stock power assuming everything else equal. I don't think the stock motor could take 1 bar of boost but it should be able to take 5 to 7 psi with good cooling and a proper tune.
WOW!
I figured 50-75 hp gains. My car is likely making 430-440 rwhp now, so @6 PSI what would a likely RWHP RWTQ be?
05-30-2008, 12:18 PM
#161
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2003 E55 AMG
Because with 6psi of boost we can probably make a nice 600 - 650hp car on stock internals and boltons.
Stage 2 of same setup will be with a BUILT bottom end with hopes of reaching 800hp++... The CLK63 BS Cabriolet that we are building will end up with this configuration when we are done.
On the 55, changing the blower for a bigger one is about as challenging as pulling the blower and replacing it with a TT kit.
You have to get around the electronics for the bypass valve, the supercharger clutch, the programming in the TCU, etc, etc.
If the ECU sees boost during shifts it will go into limp mode. On a normal 55 car, the ECU disengages the clutch, shifts gears, and then re-engages from what I was told. All of this leads to big programming challenges..
It's not to say that SOMEONE isn't already working on a blower replacement though.
Stage 2 of same setup will be with a BUILT bottom end with hopes of reaching 800hp++... The CLK63 BS Cabriolet that we are building will end up with this configuration when we are done.
On the 55, changing the blower for a bigger one is about as challenging as pulling the blower and replacing it with a TT kit.
You have to get around the electronics for the bypass valve, the supercharger clutch, the programming in the TCU, etc, etc.
If the ECU sees boost during shifts it will go into limp mode. On a normal 55 car, the ECU disengages the clutch, shifts gears, and then re-engages from what I was told. All of this leads to big programming challenges..
It's not to say that SOMEONE isn't already working on a blower replacement though.
Why would you go to the trouble of developing a new manifold for a 63 Kenne Bell system that will be significantly limited without changing the engine internals and lowering compression when you could do the same thing for the 55K cars that are already set up for FI? And not to mention the fact that there are many, many more of the 55K cars on the road already, and with bargain basement prices on a lot of them the market for the systems would be far larger. It's been apparent for several years that the major limitation on getting more power out of the 55K engine is the factory supercharger, and I do not understand why someone hasn't engineered a replacement blower for it that can move more air (and a KB would be a great choice).
06-07-2008, 02:31 PM
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08 C350 fully loaded
Over the last several weeks I have had a number of 63 owners expressing interest in forced induction for their cars.
After evaluating a number of possibilities in terms of what to use - turbo or supercharger - I have settled on a twin-screw from Kenne Bell.
Let me try to answer some fore coming questions to best of my knowledge at this time.
1. What kind of power increase can be expected?
Since M156 runs 11.3:1 CR, 3-4 psi will be boost limit for Stage I, as R&D progresses and transmission strength can be verified, more boost would be possible. I am expecting 70HP/70TQ at the wheels at this boost level, more with other mods.
2. Price?
At this time it is hard to predict. I will do everything I can to make it affordable.
3. Will it work with other mods?
Not with software, but with headers, exhaust, intake and so forth should not be a problem.
4. What do I do next?
If you are interested and serious about this kit, I need to hear from you, so I can judge the demand more precisely. Just e-mail me your name, model and contact information.
Thank you for listening.
After evaluating a number of possibilities in terms of what to use - turbo or supercharger - I have settled on a twin-screw from Kenne Bell.
Let me try to answer some fore coming questions to best of my knowledge at this time.
1. What kind of power increase can be expected?
Since M156 runs 11.3:1 CR, 3-4 psi will be boost limit for Stage I, as R&D progresses and transmission strength can be verified, more boost would be possible. I am expecting 70HP/70TQ at the wheels at this boost level, more with other mods.
2. Price?
At this time it is hard to predict. I will do everything I can to make it affordable.
3. Will it work with other mods?
Not with software, but with headers, exhaust, intake and so forth should not be a problem.
4. What do I do next?
If you are interested and serious about this kit, I need to hear from you, so I can judge the demand more precisely. Just e-mail me your name, model and contact information.
Thank you for listening.
I am interested but I am a c350 owner, you think it would be possible to make a kit for me. All I wan't is a modest 40-60 hp increase to the wheels.
3-4 psi
06-07-2008, 03:14 PM
#166
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08 CLS63
06-07-2008, 05:35 PM
#167
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V12-Biturbo
& cost thousands less ie.. about $1500-$2k installed
Last edited by Thericker; 06-07-2008 at 05:39 PM.
06-07-2008, 07:59 PM
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'05 C55(sold)'05 E55(sold)'06 911C4S(sold)'06 ML350 '06 CLS55(sold),buncha slo bikes
Bro for "All I want is a modest 40-60 hp increase to the wheels." the KB is not going to be cost effective, if you can't afford to move up to a used 63, then slap on some giggle juice! a 50 shot of NOS should be safe enough
& cost thousands less ie.. about $1500-$2k installed
& cost thousands less ie.. about $1500-$2k installed
I'm pretty sure ItallionStallion still has hit wet set-up off of his CLK500 for sale,maybe PM him?
06-07-2008, 09:47 PM
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'05 C55(sold)'05 E55(sold)'06 911C4S(sold)'06 ML350 '06 CLS55(sold),buncha slo bikes
06-07-2008, 10:57 PM
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08 C350 fully loaded
ha ha very funny. The thing is I have a lease and the negative balance is ten grand. I sat in a few dealerships and carmax and all i could get for the car was 32,500. The payoff was 42,000 after nearly one year of a 4 year lease.
Ok so instead I decided to mod my car to be a little more happy with it. I sunk 4 grand into rims and Kw coilovers.
the lowest monthly I wouldv'e gotten with a ten grand down payment and a Ten grand negative balance added onto my lease was 1247 a month. I pay 721 a month right now. that's 500 dollars more per month.
People whith 5 grand down are getting 1000 dollar a month payments. I just didn't see why the dealer had to make so much money on my trade.
Instead I made an even worse decision and modded. Well now I'm stuck. threw a lot of capital away and I sold my stock wheels. LOL! pretty much in it for the long haul. Just trying to get some better pedal feel and I will get a sprint booster but I definetly need some forced induction on a daily basis. No Nitrous, I don't race. I wan't to just have that supercharger whine and a stiff gas pedal that yanks when you press it. I bought my car last september, I couldn't stand driving my banged up Nissan any longer in order to wait for the C63.
Going to start Graduate school in August and I wan't to be done modding so I can focus on school. Once I get my Masters I will get the c63 or an rs6 or something crazy to make up for right now.
Ok so instead I decided to mod my car to be a little more happy with it. I sunk 4 grand into rims and Kw coilovers.
the lowest monthly I wouldv'e gotten with a ten grand down payment and a Ten grand negative balance added onto my lease was 1247 a month. I pay 721 a month right now. that's 500 dollars more per month.
People whith 5 grand down are getting 1000 dollar a month payments. I just didn't see why the dealer had to make so much money on my trade.
Instead I made an even worse decision and modded. Well now I'm stuck. threw a lot of capital away and I sold my stock wheels. LOL! pretty much in it for the long haul. Just trying to get some better pedal feel and I will get a sprint booster but I definetly need some forced induction on a daily basis. No Nitrous, I don't race. I wan't to just have that supercharger whine and a stiff gas pedal that yanks when you press it. I bought my car last september, I couldn't stand driving my banged up Nissan any longer in order to wait for the C63.
Going to start Graduate school in August and I wan't to be done modding so I can focus on school. Once I get my Masters I will get the c63 or an rs6 or something crazy to make up for right now.
Last edited by c350blknav; 06-07-2008 at 11:00 PM.
