Heat Wrapping Intake Tubes - Does Work!! (Supporting Data and Pictures)
Banned
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 971
Likes: 1
From: D.C. METRO AREA
CLS55 AMG
The heat exchanger cools the compressed air that is charged with *heat* by the supercharger. The compression process creates heat. This is called charged air and is referred to as the charged air temperature. No one is suggesting that air pass through the heat exchanger. If it did it would be a intercooler no a heat exchanger.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,052
Likes: 1
CLS55 Designo 030
The HE does not cool the compressed air directly. The IC does. The HE does cool the IC in order to cool the compressed air going through it.
At the end of the day, the process is extremely inefficient. The IC on our cars (32K/55K) have been the weakest link throughout all these years. Only the SLR setup had the problem tackled.
I agree with the post about "every little bit helps"... better flowing IC pumps, separating cooling circuits, upgraded HE's, extra reservoirs, phenolic spacers, modified thermostats, heat wrapping components, even taking the rubber isolation from the hood, will bring an edge to that extra second of avoiding heat soak and consequently, timing. Specially to the 1/4 mile rockets out there...
At the end of the day, the process is extremely inefficient. The IC on our cars (32K/55K) have been the weakest link throughout all these years. Only the SLR setup had the problem tackled.
I agree with the post about "every little bit helps"... better flowing IC pumps, separating cooling circuits, upgraded HE's, extra reservoirs, phenolic spacers, modified thermostats, heat wrapping components, even taking the rubber isolation from the hood, will bring an edge to that extra second of avoiding heat soak and consequently, timing. Specially to the 1/4 mile rockets out there...
Last edited by ///AMG4EVER; Aug 19, 2009 at 03:39 PM. Reason: spell check
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 6,649
Likes: 207
'03 E55, Range Rover Sport Supercharged, Ducati 748R
our i/c circuits don't see high enough temps for waterwetter to become effective...however i still use it in a small quantity for it's lubrication properties.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,856
Likes: 4
02 C32 AMG
The HE does not cool the compressed air directly. The IC does. The HE does cool the IC in order to cool the compressed air going through it.
At the end of the day, the process is extremely inefficient. The IC on our cars (32K/55K) have been the weakest link throughtout all these years. Only the SLR setup had the problem tackled.
I agree with the post about "every little bit helps"... better flowing IC pumps, separating cooling circuits, upgraded HE, extra reservoirs, phenolic spacers, modified thermostats, heat wrapping components, even taking the rubber isolation from the hood, will bring an edge to that extra second of avoiding heat soak and consequently, timing. Specially to the 1/4 mile rockets out there...
At the end of the day, the process is extremely inefficient. The IC on our cars (32K/55K) have been the weakest link throughtout all these years. Only the SLR setup had the problem tackled.
I agree with the post about "every little bit helps"... better flowing IC pumps, separating cooling circuits, upgraded HE, extra reservoirs, phenolic spacers, modified thermostats, heat wrapping components, even taking the rubber isolation from the hood, will bring an edge to that extra second of avoiding heat soak and consequently, timing. Specially to the 1/4 mile rockets out there...
i think we just need to convert to SLR style top mount I/Cs. i think this is how vadim somehow put down 420whp on the c32 with the much smaller 178mm crank pulley.
or somehow (and i have no idea how) convert to an air/air FMIC setup.....though that might be far-fetched....(edit)....and possibly not worth it?
Last edited by jturkel; Aug 19, 2009 at 02:29 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 336
Likes: 0
From: Salt Lake City, UT
2002 BMW M5, 1992 AWD DSM, 1988 Yamaha FZR1000
Yeesh, why would you ever want to go air-to-air? A2W is far more efficient... Might as well ditch the blower and mount a pair of GT42R turbos under each manifold while you're at it.
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 475
Likes: 0
From: Latitude 26.1695, Longitude -80.0997
my wife wild, but she loves every minute of it.
Former Vendor of MBWorld
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,193
Likes: 3
From: Glendale Arizona
C55,SL55,C63
I would be interested to know what cools better, A2W or A2A. I know air cools faster than water, but it also heats up faster than water.
Former Vendor of MBWorld
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,193
Likes: 3
From: Glendale Arizona
C55,SL55,C63
I use some water wetter too. The stuff foams up though. From what I hear WW is just a mild soap. Makes me wonder if WW is foaming inside the IC or HE thus decreasing the suffuse area of the cooling system.
MB World Stories
The Best of Mercedes & AMG
Manual Mercedes? 6 Times Sindelfingen Let Drivers Have All The Fun
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Verdad Gallardo
8 Classic Boxy Mercedes Designs That Have Aged Like Fine Wine
Verdad Gallardo
Flawlessly Restored Mercedes 190E Evo II Heads to Auction
Verdad Gallardo
Electric Mercedes C-Class Unveiled: 11 Things You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes EQS Gets A Major Update: Everything You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
5 Underrated Mercedes-Benz Models That Don't Get the Love They Deserve
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes 300D Has Pushed Well Past 1 Million Miles and It Ain't Stopping
Verdad Gallardo
10 Most Reliable Mercedes-Benz Models You Can Buy Used
Verdad Gallardo
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 13,489
Likes: 96
haters crazy
The inherent downfall to water to air setup is heat soak. I'm sure you've all noticed you make a pass, then shut off the car for a few minutes and the water is really hot. Thats why an ice reservoir is good, so you can just drop some ice in it and get IATs to below ambient. As long as you keep movig water to air setup is very efficient. I read somewhere that water is 4X more efficient than air. Less of a boost drop across the intercooler as well
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,342
Likes: 11
From: PA
S600, GL450, GLC 43
Some good reading if you are NOT very familiar with air to air and water to air IC's and HE's
http://autospeed.com/cms/title_The-C...0/article.html
Enjoy
http://autospeed.com/cms/title_The-C...0/article.html
Enjoy
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 6,897
Likes: 85
From: Central WI (BFE)
SL55, ML500 & Acura TL
Both WW and soap have surfactants in them. Surfactants break the surface tension property of water which in a way makes water wetter by allowing it to make better surface contact. I suspect that WW does not foam up once under pressure as it would be in a hot radiator.
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 475
Likes: 0
From: Latitude 26.1695, Longitude -80.0997
my wife wild, but she loves every minute of it.
Good explanation. I have never seen it foam, and I also suspect it would be impossible for it to foam under pressure.
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 336
Likes: 0
From: Salt Lake City, UT
2002 BMW M5, 1992 AWD DSM, 1988 Yamaha FZR1000
I got another spool of gold tape and finished wrapping the other intake tube.
As far as wrapping the bottom of the airboxes, how do you guys go about doing that? What is the procedure to remove them? Am I going to break those "one-of" clips on the plastic Y coupler?
As far as wrapping the bottom of the airboxes, how do you guys go about doing that? What is the procedure to remove them? Am I going to break those "one-of" clips on the plastic Y coupler?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,697
Likes: 381
2005 E55
When I get some time I will log my iats with some wrap on the intakes,Im suprised nobody has done this yet.
I have too much going on at the same time and I want to test them out right.
I have a let H/E going in and want to test everything by it self ect.
I have too much going on at the same time and I want to test them out right.
I have a let H/E going in and want to test everything by it self ect.
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 411
Likes: 0
2003 E55 K1
I have a difficult time seeing how these wraps can make much difference in the temperature of the air given the extremely short resonance time of the air in the tube. We are talking about a huge volume of air entering the tube at ambient temperatures and passing through the tube in milliseconds.
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 389
Likes: 2
From: Texas
2005 Silver E55
let me throw another wrench in . how about cool cans , were you can ice down your fuel. Its cheap, easy to install and this to will lower you air temps inside the cylinder were it finally matters. I have seen some custom dry ice setups over the intake pipe but as other have mentioned at some point the air is traveling so fast it doesnt have time to be cooled. AMS has a point you want any source thats heating your air to be fixed first which is why , improving the HE can make some nice gains, I think its well proven the colder the starting temps the cooler the IATs. this why our cars run so much better in the winter even if the SC is heating the air it will only change the Delta a set amount. Laws of thermal dynamics. if the SC heats the air 100 degrees then with a starting temp of 100 degrees the final temp is 200 degrees , so if you can lower the starting temp to 50 degrees you will improve performance. granted the small amount of temp increase by the intake duct is probably not going to be perceivable. I dont think even consistent runs on the dyno would show up. the variable is to great. this is why NOS is so great . you get extra O2 and a significant temp drop as well. I have seen custom dry ice setups on the intercooler and this seems to help alot but its time limited as well. when the ice melts you back to square 1. works at the drag strip where you can prep before each run. I did a small ice ETOH mixture to spray on my Evo intercooler continuously and I did see closer to 20 degree IAT drops but it didnt change my 1/4 time or speed. I guess to many other factors like launch, shifts, traction to be proven. good discussion tho. I guess if I had a choice , NOS is the simple solution.
Last edited by mikeevo; Feb 23, 2010 at 03:02 PM.
Super Member
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 575
Likes: 2
From: Lake Norman
CTS-V 2013 Wagon
I have a difficult time seeing how these wraps can make much difference in the temperature of the air given the extremely short resonance time of the air in the tube. We are talking about a huge volume of air entering the tube at ambient temperatures and passing through the tube in milliseconds.
And the more RPM's the less time the air is in the air tube. I can't imagine wrapping the plastic ducts would decrease inlet temperatures by a moderate amount while air is flowing through them. My bet is if you could somehow measure any performance gain, it would equal something like removing the floor mats.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 6,213
Likes: 8
LET C32 2002
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/DEI-010417/
ordered 2 of these for my intakes, should be here tommorrow
ordered 2 of these for my intakes, should be here tommorrow
Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 187
Likes: 0
From: Daytona Beach
2004 E55 AMG
The way I measure it, each tube is right at 18", so one wrap can cover both.
Just ordered oner and also some reflective sheet wrap..getting into the hot season in Florida and it can't hurt. Cheap enough to try.
Just ordered oner and also some reflective sheet wrap..getting into the hot season in Florida and it can't hurt. Cheap enough to try.
Super Member
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 661
Likes: 3
From: Saudi Arabia - Qatif
Brabus K8 E55 05
I am planning to wrap mine too + get the airbox filters insulated with insulation tape too But I don't have tools to test the temperature but definitely if I did both it will change even a little.
There is another idea to insulate heat from the plastic airbox which is creating a layer from below using materials that when dry it makes like cement (hard) layer. It is possible to apply thin layer that would be a good mod.
I am planning to put the high temperature tape on the airbox filters below and up to insulate heat and hoping that will make better performance.
But I don't have tools to test the temperature but definitely if I did both it will change even a little.There is another idea to insulate heat from the plastic airbox which is creating a layer from below using materials that when dry it makes like cement (hard) layer. It is possible to apply thin layer that would be a good mod.
I am planning to put the high temperature tape on the airbox filters below and up to insulate heat and hoping that will make better performance.
