**** REMEMBER MHP? ****
08-14-2009, 01:02 AM
#76
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: school west coast-Summer Internships Va and Bmore
Posts: 1,287
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
E55 (for sale if the right offer comes along)...too many others to list
Hooleyboy,
I heard you guys are doing some great things over there! Keep up the good work buddy. I wished I lived close to your shop.
I heard you guys are doing some great things over there! Keep up the good work buddy. I wished I lived close to your shop.
08-14-2009, 01:15 AM
#77
Out Of Control!!
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: San Diego
Posts: 13,394
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes
on
4 Posts
2015 S212
Also, just for the record since everyone is getting half posts. Rick is not a risk trader. So when he says $4k in a day, it doesn't also mean $7k loss. He sells cars and an undisclosed place. It isn't even an MB shop. The story is just that he earns his money by working with clients all day and yet has a stellar reputation. Being in that industry and having his expectations makes it frustrating all the more when you get shafted.
Perhaps some of Rick's probation came due to his mild mannered explorations into sponsorship.
Make em all happy, Rick. Start up J and R, pay to sponsor and let it roll.....
Perhaps some of Rick's probation came due to his mild mannered explorations into sponsorship.
Make em all happy, Rick. Start up J and R, pay to sponsor and let it roll.....
08-14-2009, 02:36 AM
#78
MBWorld Fanatic!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: S.D Cali
Posts: 1,885
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
CLS63
WOW did this ever explode. Funny thing is the last tune I got from Andy I have data from the DYNO SHOP. I promised Andy I wouldn't tell anyone that it wouldn't go over 150 mph. He wanted me to let him try to tune it again before I said any thing. I really did like the Fcker and had his back many many times, Remember the header thread? well NO LT's still 
Remember Famosa I said I never got the MHP tune so I wouldn't have to say the tune SUCKED PIG SH8T. (sorry) Well, you guys that know me know if I'm Talking it's TRUE. You Andy said you are making a killing doing tuning in INDIA with lambo's and sooo many high line cars,, Well with all the client's you have then a cashiers check is but a drop in the bucket for a man such as you.. So refund and let it end. That simple bro. You gave me the # to your tuners to send my ecu to them for tuning now you say It's my fault 
WOW you forgot about that? Guys I really don't want to continue wasting my time with this guy. Hey mod can you take me off probation???? 
MY AZZ HURTS.. Good luck ANDY 
08-14-2009, 03:56 AM
#80
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,336
Likes: 0
Received 7 Likes
on
7 Posts
Porsche 991S, Cayenne S, 1972 BMW 3.0CS E9 Coupe
I've been shopping tuners and have ruled out MHP. For one reason and one reason only. NOT because of what people on MBWorld have said about him. But BECAUSE of the WAY the guy responds to criticism. (and I've been following the "tuner saga" here for a while)
It's absolutely bizarre. I've never experienced a business person with such insecurity go on the defensive. The guy must have Sarah Palin DNA or something.
Seriously, why would someone who is doing so well and offers such an excellent product, and with big paying customers around the world (and able to distribute their product through MB/BMW/Audi dealers, etc.), get on the internet and act this way? It makes no sense whatsoever. And why not just do a refund and let it go? (And let the ego go, too, btw)
If I sell a great product and am the very best out there, and doing a great business, then there's no reason for me to get defensive over some forum members who are pissed off about me and my product. Why the hell should I care? So what? I know I'm the best and I'm doing a profitable business.
I've seen complaints about Renntech and Kleemann's products. But I've never seen those companies get on forums and start defending themselves in a school boy manner.
I've read his posts on AD and it's kinda mind boggling. And that's what has put a sour taste in my mouth with MHP. Not people bashing MHP on forums. I'm an adult and I can do my own research. But when a business goes on the extreme defense like that, I'm running the other way.
I know he doesn't do the tunes himself (hires other people) and I've spoken with Dave recently about tuning (which is odd because Andy says he's no longer using Dave
) It doesn't matter if Andy's just the front and people behind him are doing the work. And that even makes the whole defensive response by him more odd. He's not the "skilled artist with the ego," but he sure acts like it Why?
I'm in a competitive field but we don't attack each other and claim superiority (and it's all about IP in my work.) The top people in my business just go about doing their best work and let it speak for itself. And we get criticism everyday. So what.
In the end, the product talks. And if it's the best then there's no reason to give a damn what other people might say about it, good or bad.
It's just stupid childish sh*t otherwise.
It's absolutely bizarre. I've never experienced a business person with such insecurity go on the defensive. The guy must have Sarah Palin DNA or something.
Seriously, why would someone who is doing so well and offers such an excellent product, and with big paying customers around the world (and able to distribute their product through MB/BMW/Audi dealers, etc.), get on the internet and act this way? It makes no sense whatsoever. And why not just do a refund and let it go? (And let the ego go, too, btw)
If I sell a great product and am the very best out there, and doing a great business, then there's no reason for me to get defensive over some forum members who are pissed off about me and my product. Why the hell should I care? So what? I know I'm the best and I'm doing a profitable business.
I've seen complaints about Renntech and Kleemann's products. But I've never seen those companies get on forums and start defending themselves in a school boy manner.
I've read his posts on AD and it's kinda mind boggling. And that's what has put a sour taste in my mouth with MHP. Not people bashing MHP on forums. I'm an adult and I can do my own research. But when a business goes on the extreme defense like that, I'm running the other way.
I know he doesn't do the tunes himself (hires other people) and I've spoken with Dave recently about tuning (which is odd because Andy says he's no longer using Dave
) It doesn't matter if Andy's just the front and people behind him are doing the work. And that even makes the whole defensive response by him more odd. He's not the "skilled artist with the ego," but he sure acts like it Why?I'm in a competitive field but we don't attack each other and claim superiority (and it's all about IP in my work.) The top people in my business just go about doing their best work and let it speak for itself. And we get criticism everyday. So what.
In the end, the product talks. And if it's the best then there's no reason to give a damn what other people might say about it, good or bad.
It's just stupid childish sh*t otherwise.
Last edited by 220S; 08-14-2009 at 03:59 AM.
08-14-2009, 08:38 AM
#81
MBWorld Fanatic!
Okay, just for a little fun, I started a thread over on the C63 site regaurding the MHP tune with a poll. Let's see what developes boys and girls
08-14-2009, 09:26 AM
#82
Super Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Delran, NJ
Posts: 695
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
05 C55
I've been shopping tuners and have ruled out MHP. For one reason and one reason only. NOT because of what people on MBWorld have said about him. But BECAUSE of the WAY the guy responds to criticism. (and I've been following the "tuner saga" here for a while)
It's absolutely bizarre. I've never experienced a business person with such insecurity go on the defensive. The guy must have Sarah Palin DNA or something.
Seriously, why would someone who is doing so well and offers such an excellent product, and with big paying customers around the world (and able to distribute their product through MB/BMW/Audi dealers, etc.), get on the internet and act this way? It makes no sense whatsoever. And why not just do a refund and let it go? (And let the ego go, too, btw)
If I sell a great product and am the very best out there, and doing a great business, then there's no reason for me to get defensive over some forum members who are pissed off about me and my product. Why the hell should I care? So what? I know I'm the best and I'm doing a profitable business.
I've seen complaints about Renntech and Kleemann's products. But I've never seen those companies get on forums and start defending themselves in a school boy manner.
I've read his posts on AD and it's kinda mind boggling. And that's what has put a sour taste in my mouth with MHP. Not people bashing MHP on forums. I'm an adult and I can do my own research. But when a business goes on the extreme defense like that, I'm running the other way.
I know he doesn't do the tunes himself (hires other people) and I've spoken with Dave recently about tuning (which is odd because Andy says he's no longer using Dave) It doesn't matter if Andy's just the front and people behind him are doing the work. And that even makes the whole defensive response by him more odd. He's not the "skilled artist with the ego," but he sure acts like it Why?
I'm in a competitive field but we don't attack each other and claim superiority (and it's all about IP in my work.) The top people in my business just go about doing their best work and let it speak for itself. And we get criticism everyday. So what.
In the end, the product talks. And if it's the best then there's no reason to give a damn what other people might say about it, good or bad.
It's just stupid childish sh*t otherwise.
It's absolutely bizarre. I've never experienced a business person with such insecurity go on the defensive. The guy must have Sarah Palin DNA or something.
Seriously, why would someone who is doing so well and offers such an excellent product, and with big paying customers around the world (and able to distribute their product through MB/BMW/Audi dealers, etc.), get on the internet and act this way? It makes no sense whatsoever. And why not just do a refund and let it go? (And let the ego go, too, btw)
If I sell a great product and am the very best out there, and doing a great business, then there's no reason for me to get defensive over some forum members who are pissed off about me and my product. Why the hell should I care? So what? I know I'm the best and I'm doing a profitable business.
I've seen complaints about Renntech and Kleemann's products. But I've never seen those companies get on forums and start defending themselves in a school boy manner.
I've read his posts on AD and it's kinda mind boggling. And that's what has put a sour taste in my mouth with MHP. Not people bashing MHP on forums. I'm an adult and I can do my own research. But when a business goes on the extreme defense like that, I'm running the other way.
I know he doesn't do the tunes himself (hires other people) and I've spoken with Dave recently about tuning (which is odd because Andy says he's no longer using Dave
) It doesn't matter if Andy's just the front and people behind him are doing the work. And that even makes the whole defensive response by him more odd. He's not the "skilled artist with the ego," but he sure acts like it Why?I'm in a competitive field but we don't attack each other and claim superiority (and it's all about IP in my work.) The top people in my business just go about doing their best work and let it speak for itself. And we get criticism everyday. So what.
In the end, the product talks. And if it's the best then there's no reason to give a damn what other people might say about it, good or bad.
It's just stupid childish sh*t otherwise.
08-14-2009, 12:03 PM
#83
Super Member
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: San Ramon, CA
Posts: 841
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A Prius because I'm green
I've been shopping tuners and have ruled out MHP. For one reason and one reason only. NOT because of what people on MBWorld have said about him. But BECAUSE of the WAY the guy responds to criticism. (and I've been following the "tuner saga" here for a while)
It's absolutely bizarre. I've never experienced a business person with such insecurity go on the defensive. The guy must have Sarah Palin DNA or something.
Seriously, why would someone who is doing so well and offers such an excellent product, and with big paying customers around the world (and able to distribute their product through MB/BMW/Audi dealers, etc.), get on the internet and act this way? It makes no sense whatsoever. And why not just do a refund and let it go? (And let the ego go, too, btw)
If I sell a great product and am the very best out there, and doing a great business, then there's no reason for me to get defensive over some forum members who are pissed off about me and my product. Why the hell should I care? So what? I know I'm the best and I'm doing a profitable business.
I've seen complaints about Renntech and Kleemann's products. But I've never seen those companies get on forums and start defending themselves in a school boy manner.
I've read his posts on AD and it's kinda mind boggling. And that's what has put a sour taste in my mouth with MHP. Not people bashing MHP on forums. I'm an adult and I can do my own research. But when a business goes on the extreme defense like that, I'm running the other way.
I know he doesn't do the tunes himself (hires other people) and I've spoken with Dave recently about tuning (which is odd because Andy says he's no longer using Dave) It doesn't matter if Andy's just the front and people behind him are doing the work. And that even makes the whole defensive response by him more odd. He's not the "skilled artist with the ego," but he sure acts like it Why?
I'm in a competitive field but we don't attack each other and claim superiority (and it's all about IP in my work.) The top people in my business just go about doing their best work and let it speak for itself. And we get criticism everyday. So what.
In the end, the product talks. And if it's the best then there's no reason to give a damn what other people might say about it, good or bad.
It's just stupid childish sh*t otherwise.
It's absolutely bizarre. I've never experienced a business person with such insecurity go on the defensive. The guy must have Sarah Palin DNA or something.
Seriously, why would someone who is doing so well and offers such an excellent product, and with big paying customers around the world (and able to distribute their product through MB/BMW/Audi dealers, etc.), get on the internet and act this way? It makes no sense whatsoever. And why not just do a refund and let it go? (And let the ego go, too, btw)
If I sell a great product and am the very best out there, and doing a great business, then there's no reason for me to get defensive over some forum members who are pissed off about me and my product. Why the hell should I care? So what? I know I'm the best and I'm doing a profitable business.
I've seen complaints about Renntech and Kleemann's products. But I've never seen those companies get on forums and start defending themselves in a school boy manner.
I've read his posts on AD and it's kinda mind boggling. And that's what has put a sour taste in my mouth with MHP. Not people bashing MHP on forums. I'm an adult and I can do my own research. But when a business goes on the extreme defense like that, I'm running the other way.
I know he doesn't do the tunes himself (hires other people) and I've spoken with Dave recently about tuning (which is odd because Andy says he's no longer using Dave
) It doesn't matter if Andy's just the front and people behind him are doing the work. And that even makes the whole defensive response by him more odd. He's not the "skilled artist with the ego," but he sure acts like it Why?I'm in a competitive field but we don't attack each other and claim superiority (and it's all about IP in my work.) The top people in my business just go about doing their best work and let it speak for itself. And we get criticism everyday. So what.
In the end, the product talks. And if it's the best then there's no reason to give a damn what other people might say about it, good or bad.
It's just stupid childish sh*t otherwise.
I was thinking exactly the same thing so thanks for writing it for me haha. Very well written with a touch of class, maybe he should come back and read this thread again a learn a thing or two. I was waiting to see him write O'Doyle rules after each response!Ewwww drama, let me get some popcorn and go get comfortable for this one!
08-14-2009, 04:23 PM
#85
Super Member
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: San Ramon, CA
Posts: 841
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A Prius because I'm green
08-14-2009, 06:51 PM
#88
08-14-2009, 09:39 PM
#92
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Tempe, Az
Posts: 1,637
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
CLS55 AMG 030
http://www.absolutelydriven.com/foru...?t=5305&page=4
some of the stuff this guy says is pretty funny , I dont know him but seems the like the kind of guy that talks tons of trash while sitting behind a computer screen but when you actually see him he is nice to your face. lol
some of the stuff this guy says is pretty funny , I dont know him but seems the like the kind of guy that talks tons of trash while sitting behind a computer screen but when you actually see him he is nice to your face. lol
08-14-2009, 10:53 PM
#93
Banned
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,477
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
SL600
http://www.absolutelydriven.com/foru...?t=5305&page=4
some of the stuff this guy says is pretty funny , I dont know him but seems the like the kind of guy that talks tons of trash while sitting behind a computer screen but when you actually see him he is nice to your face. lol
some of the stuff this guy says is pretty funny , I dont know him but seems the like the kind of guy that talks tons of trash while sitting behind a computer screen but when you actually see him he is nice to your face. lol
08-14-2009, 11:06 PM
#94
I just have one question... who had that Renntech Stage 4 E55 in the Youtube video that lost to the MHP tuned C63 (video mentioned at the AD site)? How in the world did a stage 4 run only 11.9 in the 1/4 mile?
08-14-2009, 11:29 PM
#95
Banned
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,477
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
SL600
Man, he (Andy) just keeps at it over there. Someone Fed-Ex him some Viagra and get him a mail-order bride, I just think the poor guy needs to release some tension. Aside from the rare occasions someone actually posts something, the guy is talking to himself responding to the comments here, there. Why not change your IP and come here and talk-- create a new username if you must (or have you already ), but I think refuting claims here is a little better then talking to yourself over at abdriven... just a thought, Andy.
), but I think refuting claims here is a little better then talking to yourself over at abdriven... just a thought, Andy.
08-15-2009, 12:06 AM
#96
MBWorld Fanatic!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: S.D Cali
Posts: 1,885
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
CLS63
Andy said I'm JUST A USED CAR SALES MAN That's not true
I'm a "GREAT" USED CAR SALESMAN
just wanted to clear that up I have one question for SIR ANDY:
"HOW DID I GET DAVE'S PHONE NUMBER?"
END OF STORY
how can I give someone an IP? what's an IP doing in a ECU?
08-15-2009, 03:14 AM
#97
MBWorld Fanatic!
Rick who's "IP" is on the ECU?
I thought you had three ECU's, could you walk us through the history.
Andy seems to be offering a 100% refund if the ECU has the MHP tune on it.
Any tuner can check your ECU and tell you what tune is present.
08-15-2009, 03:30 AM
#98
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,336
Likes: 0
Received 7 Likes
on
7 Posts
Porsche 991S, Cayenne S, 1972 BMW 3.0CS E9 Coupe
I believe he means intellectual property. Which brings up an interesting issue. How much IP is there, and who really owns it when it's basically a re-mapped ECU designed by another mfg.
In my own field, IP is a very thorny issue. If you take what's already there and make some tweaks, then the IP may or may not be changed enough to be recognized as new property. In addition you are basing the work on someone else's IP (in a tuner's case, Daimler AG property.)
This falls under "derivative works." Derivative works are anything that is based (derived) from an existing body of work (original authorship.) A work can be derived from an existing copyright, etc..
If you take the copyrighted source code of any program and physically modify it (revise the program) then you've created a derivative work of that program.
However, the law states that only the owner of copyright in a work has the right to prepare, or to authorize someone else to create, a new version of that work. The owner is generally the author or someone who has obtained rights from the author.
This is an issue with tuners and which is why MB doesn't recognize it (and fights any trends towards open source flashing, etc.) and to keep their own IP difficult to crack. Despite the SAE J2534 pass thru standard law.
Tuners are, to a certain degree, pirates of existing IP. The irony is that the tuners want to maintain their own IP rights, yet they are utilizing pre-existing IP from the original mfg. They are deriving works, but without the consent of the original author.
Under the law, tuners may actually have no IP rights to their own re-map. So, it's an area of law that's fuzzy. Tuners may claim IP but how that holds up in a court of law is not exactly clear. They are taking existing proprietary password protected code and unraveling it, and then claiming to be changing enough to therefore warrant new IP. And they password protect it. So they are actually doing themselves what they don't want the consumer of the tune to do. Hypocritical to a certain degree.
Not all tuners use password protection, etc., forcing consumers to resort to reflashing completely, etc.. Some think it's not good business practice to do so. But it's probably done only because the tuners themselves don't trust each other. And so the consumer suffers.
In my own field, IP is a very thorny issue. If you take what's already there and make some tweaks, then the IP may or may not be changed enough to be recognized as new property. In addition you are basing the work on someone else's IP (in a tuner's case, Daimler AG property.)
This falls under "derivative works." Derivative works are anything that is based (derived) from an existing body of work (original authorship.) A work can be derived from an existing copyright, etc..
If you take the copyrighted source code of any program and physically modify it (revise the program) then you've created a derivative work of that program.
However, the law states that only the owner of copyright in a work has the right to prepare, or to authorize someone else to create, a new version of that work. The owner is generally the author or someone who has obtained rights from the author.
This is an issue with tuners and which is why MB doesn't recognize it (and fights any trends towards open source flashing, etc.) and to keep their own IP difficult to crack. Despite the SAE J2534 pass thru standard law.
Tuners are, to a certain degree, pirates of existing IP. The irony is that the tuners want to maintain their own IP rights, yet they are utilizing pre-existing IP from the original mfg. They are deriving works, but without the consent of the original author.
Under the law, tuners may actually have no IP rights to their own re-map. So, it's an area of law that's fuzzy. Tuners may claim IP but how that holds up in a court of law is not exactly clear. They are taking existing proprietary password protected code and unraveling it, and then claiming to be changing enough to therefore warrant new IP. And they password protect it. So they are actually doing themselves what they don't want the consumer of the tune to do. Hypocritical to a certain degree.
Not all tuners use password protection, etc., forcing consumers to resort to reflashing completely, etc.. Some think it's not good business practice to do so. But it's probably done only because the tuners themselves don't trust each other. And so the consumer suffers.
08-15-2009, 03:42 AM
#99
MBWorld Fanatic!
I believe he means intellectual property. Which brings up an interesting issue. How much IP is there, and who really owns it when it's basically a re-mapped ECU designed by another mfg.
In my own field, IP is a very thorny issue. If you take what's already there and make some tweaks, then the IP may or may not be changed enough to be recognized as new property. In addition you are basing the work on someone else's IP (in a tuner's case, Daimler AG property.)
This falls under "derivative works." Derivative works are anything that is based (derived) from an existing body of work (original authorship.) A work can be derived from an existing copyright, etc..
If you take the copyrighted source code of any program and physically modify it (revise the program) then you've created a derivative work of that program.
However, the law states that only the owner of copyright in a work has the right to prepare, or to authorize someone else to create, a new version of that work. The owner is generally the author or someone who has obtained rights from the author.
This is an issue with tuners and which is why MB doesn't recognize it (and fights any trends towards open source flashing, etc.) and to keep their own IP difficult to crack. Despite the SAE J2534 pass thru standard law.
Tuners are, to a certain degree, pirates of existing IP. The irony is that the tuners want to maintain their own IP rights, yet they are utilizing pre-existing IP from the original mfg. They are deriving works, but without the consent of the original author.
Under the law, tuners may actually have no IP rights to their own re-map. So, it's an area of law that's fuzzy. Tuners may claim IP but how that holds up in a court of law is not exactly clear. They are taking existing proprietary password protected code and unraveling it, and then claiming to be changing enough to therefore warrant new IP. And they password protect it. So they are actually doing themselves what they don't want the consumer of the tune to do. Hypocritical to a certain degree.
Not all tuners use password protection, etc., forcing consumers to resort to reflashing completely, etc.. Some think it's not good business practice to do so. But it's probably done only because the tuners themselves don't trust each other. And so the consumer suffers.
In my own field, IP is a very thorny issue. If you take what's already there and make some tweaks, then the IP may or may not be changed enough to be recognized as new property. In addition you are basing the work on someone else's IP (in a tuner's case, Daimler AG property.)
This falls under "derivative works." Derivative works are anything that is based (derived) from an existing body of work (original authorship.) A work can be derived from an existing copyright, etc..
If you take the copyrighted source code of any program and physically modify it (revise the program) then you've created a derivative work of that program.
However, the law states that only the owner of copyright in a work has the right to prepare, or to authorize someone else to create, a new version of that work. The owner is generally the author or someone who has obtained rights from the author.
This is an issue with tuners and which is why MB doesn't recognize it (and fights any trends towards open source flashing, etc.) and to keep their own IP difficult to crack. Despite the SAE J2534 pass thru standard law.
Tuners are, to a certain degree, pirates of existing IP. The irony is that the tuners want to maintain their own IP rights, yet they are utilizing pre-existing IP from the original mfg. They are deriving works, but without the consent of the original author.
Under the law, tuners may actually have no IP rights to their own re-map. So, it's an area of law that's fuzzy. Tuners may claim IP but how that holds up in a court of law is not exactly clear. They are taking existing proprietary password protected code and unraveling it, and then claiming to be changing enough to therefore warrant new IP. And they password protect it. So they are actually doing themselves what they don't want the consumer of the tune to do. Hypocritical to a certain degree.
Not all tuners use password protection, etc., forcing consumers to resort to reflashing completely, etc.. Some think it's not good business practice to do so. But it's probably done only because the tuners themselves don't trust each other. And so the consumer suffers.
Excellent post and I appreciate the education.
I wonder if any tuner has legal authority to seek damages for stolen ip based on a software not owned by the actual tuner but Mercedes Benz(Daimler)
08-15-2009, 05:14 AM
#100
I've been shopping tuners and have ruled out MHP. For one reason and one reason only. NOT because of what people on MBWorld have said about him. But BECAUSE of the WAY the guy responds to criticism. (and I've been following the "tuner saga" here for a while)
It's absolutely bizarre. I've never experienced a business person with such insecurity go on the defensive. The guy must have Sarah Palin DNA or something.
Seriously, why would someone who is doing so well and offers such an excellent product, and with big paying customers around the world (and able to distribute their product through MB/BMW/Audi dealers, etc.), get on the internet and act this way? It makes no sense whatsoever. And why not just do a refund and let it go? (And let the ego go, too, btw)
If I sell a great product and am the very best out there, and doing a great business, then there's no reason for me to get defensive over some forum members who are pissed off about me and my product. Why the hell should I care? So what? I know I'm the best and I'm doing a profitable business.
I've seen complaints about Renntech and Kleemann's products. But I've never seen those companies get on forums and start defending themselves in a school boy manner.
I've read his posts on AD and it's kinda mind boggling. And that's what has put a sour taste in my mouth with MHP. Not people bashing MHP on forums. I'm an adult and I can do my own research. But when a business goes on the extreme defense like that, I'm running the other way.
I know he doesn't do the tunes himself (hires other people) and I've spoken with Dave recently about tuning (which is odd because Andy says he's no longer using Dave) It doesn't matter if Andy's just the front and people behind him are doing the work. And that even makes the whole defensive response by him more odd. He's not the "skilled artist with the ego," but he sure acts like it Why?
I'm in a competitive field but we don't attack each other and claim superiority (and it's all about IP in my work.) The top people in my business just go about doing their best work and let it speak for itself. And we get criticism everyday. So what.
In the end, the product talks. And if it's the best then there's no reason to give a damn what other people might say about it, good or bad.
It's just stupid childish sh*t otherwise.
It's absolutely bizarre. I've never experienced a business person with such insecurity go on the defensive. The guy must have Sarah Palin DNA or something.
Seriously, why would someone who is doing so well and offers such an excellent product, and with big paying customers around the world (and able to distribute their product through MB/BMW/Audi dealers, etc.), get on the internet and act this way? It makes no sense whatsoever. And why not just do a refund and let it go? (And let the ego go, too, btw)
If I sell a great product and am the very best out there, and doing a great business, then there's no reason for me to get defensive over some forum members who are pissed off about me and my product. Why the hell should I care? So what? I know I'm the best and I'm doing a profitable business.
I've seen complaints about Renntech and Kleemann's products. But I've never seen those companies get on forums and start defending themselves in a school boy manner.
I've read his posts on AD and it's kinda mind boggling. And that's what has put a sour taste in my mouth with MHP. Not people bashing MHP on forums. I'm an adult and I can do my own research. But when a business goes on the extreme defense like that, I'm running the other way.
I know he doesn't do the tunes himself (hires other people) and I've spoken with Dave recently about tuning (which is odd because Andy says he's no longer using Dave
) It doesn't matter if Andy's just the front and people behind him are doing the work. And that even makes the whole defensive response by him more odd. He's not the "skilled artist with the ego," but he sure acts like it Why?I'm in a competitive field but we don't attack each other and claim superiority (and it's all about IP in my work.) The top people in my business just go about doing their best work and let it speak for itself. And we get criticism everyday. So what.
In the end, the product talks. And if it's the best then there's no reason to give a damn what other people might say about it, good or bad.
It's just stupid childish sh*t otherwise.
Maybe I missed something but when I remember back to early this spring I thought Andy said he was going to be at some early season event at MIR running against some other guys and showing us some real impressive numbers. I never heard anymore about that? Sometime shortly after that I think is when they may have been banned on that forum.
Anyway, I just caught this thread over here and it just confirms my original thoughts that MHP was going to make somebody unhappy, it was just a matter of time. A shame really because it looks like they have developed some great stuff for the 63's, like those LT headers. Oh well.
