Literaly hundreds.

Dude I never said your car was a hooptie I was plainly asking questions and again you never answered them so I guess you might not know. I have done nothing more then try to help you, I understand your upset but you need to get to the bottom of your problem first. I dont know what you do with your car and you made more power then the others because you had more mods then the others. Running over 130 on the street 3 times in row says enough.

Speaking of the data I got from you all the data I needed and now im being called a traveling gypsy? Go figures.

And for you to say all I wanted to do is take your money and run your full of it, I talk to all my customers first ask them what they want and kind of shine some light on whats going to go on with there cars and then ask them if they have any questions, you said you didnt want to go crazy and I didnt I put a safe tune on your car.

I am very sorry if my post was not professional enough for you all I was doing was asking questions, you took it out of context.

How long have you had this tune? If there was an issue did you get it corrected right away? Send me you dyno sheets I would like to see this.

 

yes,jerry sent me the laptop and just flashed a file that had alot more fuel(I still have the laptop)I am about to redyno it to see how the updated file looks.

I sent him the sheets and said it was was very lean and not to drive it at all and it needs more fuel asap.

so I babied the car and kept it off boost until we got a new file on there.I havnt been beating on the car since I havnt seen the new a/f(my dyno shop decided to rip the dyno out)the day before I got the new tune because they are goin 4wd dyno.They should be good to go next week.

 

Finally got some good pics here, so what do those pictures prove?

So now that we have that lets ask ourselves a few questions here:
Well if there was a lean issue why was there no damage to the leanest cylinder?

If there was serious detonation do to excessive timing where are all the bent rods?

Hot spots on that piston and melted spark plugs umm, I wonder if a foreign object got in there and broke something cause no spark and then causing pre-ignition? (pre-ignition and detenation are not the same thing.)

FYI that has happen in the past, a supercharger screw broke and done some damage.

Could there been a hot spot in the block at where the whole was created and again caused pre-ignition there?

Guys dont forget the srt guys run there cars with mods and no tuning running in the 16's on the top end wow no blown engines there either. Lots of questions to ask.

So now that the surgeon I'm sorry I meant the tuner has been blatantly blamed why even ask the questions?

 

Hey thanks for that, was that done at the tail pipe or was it tapped up front?

 

I dont know if you can see those,for some reason when i uploaded them seem really small.

that was done as far up the tailpipe as we could get it,so its a little richer than that because of the cats ect.

the new file should have more fuel but again I havnt put it on the dyno yet.

do you have a newer file?maybe I got an older file by accident

with the new file I noticed the s/c kicking in with alot less throttle input and it makes normal driving alittle harsh.

I have 180 pulley,H/E,82mm tb and your tune so far and looking into headers next.

 

Alright I saw it and your running in the 12's from the mid to top end and do not forget that your engine will run about a half point richer then the tail sniffer also depending on the sample rate of the dyno it my not be right on point and position, that was not bad and your engine would not have melted.

 

Yeah, still have that Jeep... cannot kill the thing... most reliable POS I've ever had!

Yeah, the ebay people will always negotiate me down, so I had to start a bit higher... storage and polishing fee. That's still a great price for a barely used engine AND tranny with less than 8k miles on it. And it rolls around, so that's very cool. I should post a video.

I'm glad I never had to use it. I can't believe I lucked out with JUST a cracked piston and no cylinder damage whatsoever. But it is nice to have one of these floating around in the garage.

You got rid of you 55... didn't you? P Car if I remember... or an Audi. You're right, its been forever. I'll try and say hi more often!



Loren

 

Okay guys, not having a dog that will hunt as I have the V-12. I have to step forward to say a few things about LET.

1. I can FULLY collaborate Tony's caution tune as I too have an LET tune, and was asked SEVERAL times by Jerry "What was I looking for". NOT how much could he get.
With that in mind, I asked for a VERY cautious tune, and Jerry COMPLETELY agreed that what I was looking for was indeed a VERY cautious tune. In fact he was surprised and HAPPY that I did not want more. Jerry left ALOT on the table, in his own humble words.

2. I was there and watched ALL dyno pulls, and me made a bunch, and at ANY time if I did not like what I saw on the DYNO he aborted it, and changed a few parameters to make me MORE comfortable. Albeit I am VERY nervous about tweaking engine parameters. Jerry answered any and all questions to make me more comfortable.

3. NEVER did my AF ratio go above 12.5, and NEVER did he try to lean it out for more power. If memory serves me right, we ended up with a little below 12.0.

4. I have driven this car now for about 8000 miles and have LOVED every minute of it.

5. I would and HAVE recommended LET to everyone, including a few nay sayers in this post.

6. LET has CONTINUED to give me support with any and all questions that I have had, NONE of which have been about the tune.

Oh well just my $0.02 but I will say LET FAR exceeded my expectations.

THANKS again Jerry and everyone else at LET

To the OP, I am very sorry to see the HUGE headache you have, and wish you the best of luck my friend.

 

I pretty much read through the whole post and I feel for both sides of this problem.

I am sure that we can all agree that no owner wants to have a blown motor and no shop wants a customers motor to blow up. That being said, these things do happen.

There are many things that can lead to an engine being blown up. Pictures are never going to be the answer to the reason it broke, there are probably quite a few areas that you want to look at but it is so hard to do that in a photo. It's nice to look at the piston with the hole in it but what about the other 7 pistons, what do they look like? Is this the only piston in the engine with damage?

The piston has an obvious hole burnt in it as does the cylinder wall. I am sure that an expert can diagnose that a lot better than us looking at it on a picture. It must have gotten pretty hot pretty damn fast for that hole to not only be in the piston but to be through the cylinder wall too. That seems like some high RPM knock to me.

I would take a look at all the pistons in the engine. I would look for signs that there were problems on the rest of the pistons before I jumped to any conclusions. I would also check into some mechanical things before I jumped to any conclusions as well.

Now, I am not saying that does not mean that the tune was too aggressive and caused an issue. What I am saying is that sometimes this happens to a stock car as well. Does that mean the tuner at Mercedes F'ed up? I am just trying to keep everyone's eyes open to thinking things through.

I don't know for sure, but I would assume that once a tuner has a map done for a car with a certain set-up than that is pretty much the map that he would load up with all of those similar set-ups. I could be wrong but it would be a little crazy to build a different map for each car individually. Once you have something that works I think you would just run with it. Now, if the map in LOCO's car is way different than the map from the same tuner in a similarly modded car I would be surprised. I guess you will have the ability to actually see what's in your file at some point so, I would guess that you will know for sure. Maybe you should see for yourself the map that is in the computer before people blame it on being too aggressive.

There are a lot of things that should happen I guess but it will be hard for anything to happen that will resolve everyone's worries. I don't think a tuner is going to pay for a motor.... That is probably why the situation was handled aggressively in the first place because the customer probably wanted the tuner to pay for it. Why don't you guys figure out a way to get together, download the maps so that you could see it, go over the map and see if it was more aggressive than the map that other people are running. If it is you need to get it altered obviously. If it isn't you probably need to start checking parts in your car like your fuel pump and stuff like that.

If I sound like I am one sided here than I am sorry, because I don't mean to be. I do NOT know anyone involved in this thread. I am just trying to point out some things because I know what a pissing match stuff in here can become.

Good luck, I hope everything has a way of working out in the end.

 

Looking at those photos and seeing that the other seven pistons look normal I'd be looking at that injector being clogged or a wiring/connector issue. If the motor is Detting itself to death you're going to see it in the other cylinders as well.

One cylinder is NOT bad tuning, it's something else

 

I know this is not even close to the same boat. But I'm just going to throw it out there for what its worth. The last time I saw a piston and cylinder that looked like that (not a massive amount of detonation but a huge burn through the piston and cylinder, which tells me the hole was formed EXTREMELY fast and not over time with consistent detonation) was on a CR125 Honda which had a fuel line get pinched going through a long high G corner. Yes they're different animals and yes the CR125 was a 2-stroke (no fuel= no lubrication) race engine on the edge, but looking at the piston and cylinder I have to agree with AMGPilot and at least throw some kind of instantaneous loss of fuel up for discussion.

 

Could the knock sensor have failed ? Is this an Aluminum block without sleeves ? Is the 63 block interchangeable ? Can Batman save the World's finances ?

 

My other car has a built and forged 427...just putting that out there....what does this have to do with this thread...nothing at all......I'm a newb"viva la revolution"

 

I'm noticing alot of what I read here is very similar to the Forced Induction threads on LS2GTO and LS1TECH.

 

Now that you mention it. Very True

 

Hey Loco, have they figured out what caused it? What does your guy say to the fact it was limited to only one cylinder?

 

At this point with what tuner has said, it wont matter!! we can sit here for 3 years going back and forth.

On my behalf and the 3 mechanics that have seen the damage in person agree that given the circumstances in which this unfolded the tune is the main cause!!

FYI we will be reading the files as well and if we can we will post all values as well.

 

Did EC offer to replace the motor or to do the tear down for you?

 

Tony or Jerry... (LET)

You have been good to me as a customer.. could not be happier with my car set up.

You are doing the right thing and confronting the issues and reassuring customers if they have doubts, you will be provide support. Every engine is different, but base tunes can be loaded to with parameters at safe level.

In my case, I'm going to data logg and send you my files for your review.. if you feel timing is a bit aggressive.. than we can take this offline. Also it will help me understand more about the subject.

 

It never got to that point!! But yet you can see Tony offering all the help in the world and how worried he is..

 

Luis when i first talked to you i offered to have the car shipped to us and we would tear it down you told me you already had it sent to TTM and did not want to ship the car

And we also gave you the option to have it sent to our dealer in NJ but again you declined because you already had someone looking at it

I am in no way trying to get in to a pissing match with you but dont sit here and say we didn't offer it to you when i personally offered to ship the car here and Tony offered to have our NJ Dealer look at it


Greg

 

I gotta be honest here, I had a long phone conversation with Jerry about the situation. I have an EC tune and while I have never had a problem with any of my tunes from them, I was a little nervous I must admit. In the past, even Alex can attest, EC usually will step up to the plate if they were 100% at fault as in the clogging of Alexs oil return causing an blown engine. Jerry told me he offered help in fixing and helping find out what caused the problem. I get nervous tunning a car no matter who the tuner is! The way I see it, the factory put millions of dollars building these engines and making sure they run as they should. So I am always a bit skeptical when messing with that. One of the reasons I choose EC was that they always seemed to fix a problem if they caused it. In this case maybe they didnt have time to fully make a judgement call. They engine is in another state and Jerry tells me they were not allowed to even touch it to see what happend. I am not preaching for EC but there are alot of people with their tunes that have never had an issue. I am still a bit skeptical, but I think there needs to be alot more information put out there for people to make an informed decission.

 

On a Sunday morning 8 miles away from TTM and thinking is just a blown head gasket the last thing i have in mind is to ship my car out to Chicago my friend and after calling tony and no answer then called you and you said he will be calling me shortly which i dont think he did until the next day correct me if i am wrong..In the mean time while waiting for a tow truck I Called Bruce and sure enough he was at the shop..I am freezing my nuts out there and Chicago was definitely not my option..Help could have been worked out in many different way had you guys been more interested..

 

Sorry, a bit off topic here.... but wow: change plugs every 3k to 6k miles....

 

Was there a shop fire involved in this?








Sorry, is it too early? Hope you get the car back on the road and address what the problem was