Hulk

See post 117

E55Greasemonkey

Post #17:

Yes, I took your advice Hulk, maybe it was your theory first Just need to figure out the best nozzle size/placement. Not much space to work around the intercooler.

Hulk

If going after cooling, you don't need the fuel, so you do less meth and more water, now on your pre sc because you have are spraying 10-20% meth you can get away with a bigger nozzle but make sure your solenoid is working 100%, on the post ic use a smaller nozzle maybe 5...

When you do your make sure you are not at 120* iat to start with, start with a 90* iat and see what happens to your iats

E55Greasemonkey

I will verify the solenoid is sealing. I was thinking #5 for post-IC as well, and leave it installed where it is..save me from having to pull the SC again. The #7 there really felt like too much. I will order a #5 and a #10 to play with. At least the pre SC is easy to change out later. I've seen 90 IATS in the AM, but too much traffic to test. I can say though, on the way home today it was HOT mid 90's and the car had more power than ever in this kind of weather. Car felt like it was 70F outside!! I was seeing IAT's 5-8F over ambient with short bursts of power in city traffic. Only time I ever got that low before was a steady 70MPH cruise in cool misting rain !

Sir-Boost-a-Lot

iTrader: (1)

Brad- humor me and try a straight alcohol shot or a 90/10 alcohol/water mix, you might like the results. I've got a barrel of VP if you want to come by Mike's shop on the way home from work and try it..

Hulk

That will bring iats down for sure probably around 80-90* but make AFRs very rich and will lose power, I have seen it on the dyno

Sir-Boost-a-Lot

iTrader: (1)

Hulk you're right that the AFR will drop with the shot of alcohol but keep in mind that lower number is just a tad misleading because the ideal AFR of the alcohol being added is half that of gasoline. How much it drops depends on how much he sprays, but the potential is there for much more power with more meth in the mix via full timing advance.. It won't knock.

I don't dispute that youve seen cars lose power via a rich mixture because every car is different but my personal experience has been the opposite, seeing lost power but increased safety margins with water injection and power gains with straight meth.

E55Greasemonkey

Sure I'll give it a try. Are you going to be there later

Hulk

I agree power can be gotten with 100% meth and added timing but jerry will not do it, I asked him and he said no simply because meth kits can go bad and if you are at full boost and something goes bad with the kit it will pop, I totally understand him.

Greasemonkey, with 100% meth you will see your iats go down big time for sure, but pop it on the dyno and you will be disappointed, let us know how you fair

E55Greasemonkey

At this point I'm headed for a #3 pre SC and #7 post IC similar to what was tried and true by others in this thread. My results show the most effective place fir the nozzle for cooling is post intercooler. I still have,and do not like the left/right temp difference with the side injecting nozzle. I may install in the "denroll" position for ease of maintenance.

Sir-Boost-a-Lot

iTrader: (1)

Sure methanol parts can go bad, however so can anything else in the primary fuel system having a similar effect. There's no guarantees with anything automotive related so people just have to pay attention and be proactive with monitoring when modifying anything.

E55Greasemonkey

I'm missing something here. Doing more reading I found PD blowers need bigger nozzles if injecting pre SC...I'm going to try a single larger nozzle. #7 just isn't doing it. I really want this single nozzle to work.

Georgee6086

For what it's worth, I spoke with a local performance shop a few months ago in regards to the meth(DaSilva Raceing) who have tunned a few cars for me. 90% of the cars they do are mustangs. They typically run a #10-12 nozzel pre PD blower at 50/50 for the 5-600 rwhp guys, but said it HAS to be sprayed way upstream of the TB. As far as possible

Bramage

There is a TON of bad information in this thread. I've been running meth for almost 4 years.

AFR without Meth 11.3
AFR with 50/50 through #10 nozzle 11.1
(example of testing on dyno)

So to say: You will be much richer is wrong

Water cools AIT's better than Meth - Both help, but head to head, water is better

Water does not compress - sending Meth into Supercharger adds considerable drag

Getting the cooling effects of the spray comes post intercooler. Adding fluid into compressed air only superheats the fluid.. so the benifit of pre SC spray is not as valuable as post intercooler.. ALSO (edit) air through the Intercooler core is our weak spot. Add a bunch of denisty to air that is already hitting a bottle neck - not smart

So it seesm people are trying to reinvent the wheel.... There are a lot of good write-ups online - Meth Inj was used in WWII planes, so this is not a new thing

BagMan

With the FL heat and humidity upon us once again, I've been considering adding water/meth for cooling only.

My problem is that I have two years of warranty left and I'd be looking to do a setup that's easily hidden or removable. No Trunk tank.

I was hoping I could place the nozzle pre TB on the bottom of the plastic intake tract. That way I could just plug it up when I bring it in for service. Also use the washer reservoir for a tank.

But if it's no benefit pre throttle body, I'll just scrap the idea.

BagMan

http://www.alcoholinjectionsystems.c...icle_info.html

This article makes it seem too easy

E55Greasemonkey

I drilled out my #3 nozzle to something around a #12 or #14. Running only this nozzle pre-SC on my test run I saw 54F rise over ambient. I was also able to get the car to bog. Conclusion, even a big *** nozzle pre-sc offers little benefit.

I have found there is more to it than just IATs. Spraying post intercooler, and the mix going directly into the manifolds, and into the cylinders, seems to make the car run better and stronger. I will pull the SC in a couple days, put my #7 post-intercooler from the bottom for even distribution, and run a #5 (my #3 is ruined) pre-SC to keep the sc housing cool. The only testing left to do after that is different ratios of meth/water. Then off to the dyno in a couple weeks to prove any gains.

For future maintenance of the post IC nozzle I will have to lift/pull the SC off, however, I've got it down to about 30 minutes to remove it, and 45 minutes to put back.

Joncl

I'm curious to see the differences in power between the 50/50, 100% meth, 10/90 etc.

jcjmw

Any updates?

E55Greasemonkey

I moved the #7 post intercooler, installed from the bottom. While pulling off the SC my suspicions were confirmed- the post IC nozzle spraying from the side is not a good location. Cylinders #4 and #3 (passenger rear)are getting heavier concentrations from the spray, as I could see dried white residue around both the intake port gaskets where the liquid had pooled and dried. The other cylinders were clean. I am also running a new #3 pre SC as well. I've had some teething problems with the controller, or at least the settings. I haven't had a chance to drive the car much, but what I've found is the controller markings don't seem too accurate. I had some problems with the controller not spraying at all, then too soon..I think I have solved the problem by setting the high side around 15 PSI and start PSI around 8. If you try and set 7 or 8 start and 10 full, sometimes it will not work...I think the controller is seeing for example 9 starting and 8 full...meaning it will never come on. Even the marks for the dials isn't done right, for example there are 3 "marks" for 5 separate PSI increments?? The lack of accurate markings on the controller and lack of feedback for settings, whether a "click" type knob that you could count, or a digital display or flashing light feedback makes this a bad design. I'm also still running 80% water and the #7 seems like a little too much, another reason I set the full dial to 15 PSI (I only see 13 max). I also noticed the new nozzle location is wetting the IAT sensor. I have seen temps as low as 10 degrees below ambient after spraying and letting off throttle..I suspect the sensor is getting wet and then evaporating after the system stops spraying. THe good news is,the car is running strong..with 92F ambient, ESP-on, it will shut down my throttle for 1+ seconds due to wheel spin close to redline. ESP off will let the tires spin a little at the top of each gear and prevent the throttle cutoff. Previously this would only happen in the dead of winter!! I will try and schedule some dyno time next week. But first I will play around with the controller settings this week and monitor the IAT's. I have a #5 I can put post IC but not really in the mood to pull the SC again for a while, although now I only need lift it up a bit. Hopefully I can turn the #7 into a #5 by dialing it out with the progressive controller.

jcjmw

Thanks for the update. I really appreciate it. I think I will get a meth kit and install 2 nozzles both post iat (just like redbulljnky) and use the oem windshield wiper tank to hold my 50/50.

Does anyone remeber what size nozzle redbulljnky used?

E55Greasemonkey

By doing this you will lose the benefit of the 30F drop in IAT's the meth is providing, at least what is seen by the IAT sensor.

BagMan

With summer here, I'd thought I'd check in and see how everyone's meth setup is performing.

I have to take the plunge here soon.

Any tips for a noob? I want as simple a setup as possible.

Georgee6086

I bought a used coolingmist 150psi pump with some line,fittings,a nozzel, and check valve for $100 locally. Drilled out the nozzel to flow 700ml/min, put the nozzel in the (denroll position) and spray it manualy from a push button switch I had laying around. Works perfect! I will be adding a solenoid and Hobbs switch later. Also using wiper fluid and resivoir. Iat stays at around 85 top of 4th

BagMan

85 IAT is very low. What was the ambient?