Turbo E55 anyone?
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From: miami / delray beach
2014 E63s amg 4matic, 2009 C63, 2006 E55 AMG , 2001.5 AUDI S4 stg 3+ w/meth
just for point of reference how much "top shops" charge for one-off turbo setups on a non-turbo car, some guys on the audi forums have contacted UnderGroundRacing to twin turbo their audi S5's and UGR quoted them $50,000 with $20K deposit upfront...
http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...-twin-turbo-S5
so cost is usually the issue on one-off setups unless you do it all yourself
http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...-twin-turbo-S5
so cost is usually the issue on one-off setups unless you do it all yourself
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05 White Pano E55, Cadillac CTS-V
I would never go to UGR unless I wanted to pay triple what I could some where else for a nice setup. There are tons of shops out there that do good work and make stupid fast cars that aren't absolutely insane with prices.
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05 White Pano E55, Cadillac CTS-V
Haha, or have a friend who isn't really a good fabricator and doesn't know what they are doing and you just think they do because you don't know **** and think their stuff is awesome do it for you. lol 
That wasn't a direct quote, but close enough.
That wasn't a direct quote, but close enough.
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From: Houston/ Austin /Toronto / UAE / Minneapolis / Orlando /Cincinnati
Eurocharged Performance ML63 and TT lambo
lol. The problem you will have is getting the car to run right and then the tuning. Trust me its a nightmare, and you better practice your german and have star dev. The tuning is no where straight forward. First startup of the turbo xfire wouldn't even idle no matter what the tuning file. There is a ton to it.
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05 White Pano E55, Cadillac CTS-V
Well obviously the tuning is left to someone else like Jerry Or you could always run a standalone computer, ProEFI, AEM, Motec, Megasquirt, etc. I mean hell that is what UGR, Heffner, Dallas Performance, etc, etc. does on Gallardos, and you name it. I would personally rather have the stock ecu do the work if possible though.
Or you could always run a standalone computer, ProEFI, AEM, Motec, Megasquirt, etc. I mean hell that is what UGR, Heffner, Dallas Performance, etc, etc. does on Gallardos, and you name it. I would personally rather have the stock ecu do the work if possible though.
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Eurocharged Performance ML63 and TT lambo
Well obviously the tuning is left to someone else like Jerry Or you could always run a standalone computer, ProEFI, AEM, Motec, Megasquirt, etc. I mean hell that is what UGR, Heffner, Dallas Performance, etc, etc. does on Gallardos, and you name it. I would personally rather have the stock ecu do the work if possible though.
Or you could always run a standalone computer, ProEFI, AEM, Motec, Megasquirt, etc. I mean hell that is what UGR, Heffner, Dallas Performance, etc, etc. does on Gallardos, and you name it. I would personally rather have the stock ecu do the work if possible though.
You will just lose a lot of functionality with a standalone the way I have seen it.
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From: Oldsmar, FL
2005 E55 Wagon, 2017 C63S Cab, 1986 560SL
I didn't read every post, but I'm lost. Why would I give up the instantaneous torque of a Supercharger for the lag of a Turbocharger?
I hate the lag in my 996TT.
I hate the lag in my 996TT.
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2004 E55 AMG
Oh they aren't talking about which system is efficient or better rather the posts have come down to, who will take the oath of building a "TT system" ready for E55. The funds are ready and provided by a gentleman named "Ted" also referred to as "The MAN" and has been known to be here "before it all started". None of the tuning company have yet taken up on the challenge set forth by "Ted" though when initially the claims were that cost was the only issue.
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2012 E63 AMG
.......c'mon! Totally in accurate for tuners to say that the reason it hasn't been done is because of lack of demand that it costs too much since a s/c swap now exist etc. The E55 tt charter had been going on for a loooooong time! Loooooooong before Weistec even built the s/c for the 63 series, let alone the m113 s/c that just came out. I am sure the Weistec s/c r&d was not cheap.
........any reputable Mercedes turner would have made a fortune if a few years ago they built a tt for the e55 that actually runs and has cel and no stories. But once the mercedes tt V'8s came out, it is game over. Yes they are still expensive but customers would rather buy it from amg than listen to endless banter about tt e55 that keeps coming out from tuners and zero result.
......If any tuner truly believes that cost is the issue, here is the challenger. I'll deliver to you and e55 and write you a check for $20K and in 8 weeks you deliver the tt e55 to me, 600whp on dyno dynamics dyno, no drive ability issues, no cel and no stories. If not you pay me back the $20K back, no stories and return the car to stock with no cel, running just fine and no stories. Deal?
Ted
........any reputable Mercedes turner would have made a fortune if a few years ago they built a tt for the e55 that actually runs and has cel and no stories. But once the mercedes tt V'8s came out, it is game over. Yes they are still expensive but customers would rather buy it from amg than listen to endless banter about tt e55 that keeps coming out from tuners and zero result.
......If any tuner truly believes that cost is the issue, here is the challenger. I'll deliver to you and e55 and write you a check for $20K and in 8 weeks you deliver the tt e55 to me, 600whp on dyno dynamics dyno, no drive ability issues, no cel and no stories. If not you pay me back the $20K back, no stories and return the car to stock with no cel, running just fine and no stories. Deal?
Ted
Edit: I just saw the dyno dynamics comment, that I cannot do as we use a dynojet here in house.
I understand a few of you are saying that if it was made people would buy it but I think you are over estimating the community as a whole. To make a product like this successful you would be looking at a minimum of about 40 kits sold a year.... and at roughly half of what the cars retail for now used that is a BIG nut to crack.
If someone (like Ted) was willing to fund a one off kit we would be open to it. I just don't know how serious he is nor would I blame him if he didn't want to go down that road. Being that I am an E55 owner myself and work at AMS I am still apprehensive about taking on that project if only for the downtime associated with it.
I don't for one second think tuning is going to be easy, nothing worth having ever is. However they said that about the new GT-R too and we have put over 1500whp through the stock computer and 1600whp through a stand-alone. We just started playing with the M157 and with ONLY bolt on turbos we are tipping on the 800whp mark. https://mbworld.org/forums/w212-amg/...os-787whp.html
As far as a production part is concerned I can tell you with 99% certainly AMS will never make an E55 Twin turbo kit.
Eric
Last edited by AMS_Performance; Feb 22, 2013 at 04:38 PM.
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2012 E63 AMG
To me a turbocharger will actually give you more usable power, especially in the case of a RWD car. Having low end torque is GREAT but too much (as is the case in the E55) is really sort of useless unless your end goal is to kill tires. That lag will actually create a faster car as the tires can actually hold the power down low and be less likely to break loose while already at speed.
It's also worth mentioning you are now eliminating any power lost from actually running the supercharger being that turbos use expelled energy to create their power rather than a supercharger which uses HP to make HP.
In my personal opinion any way you slice it a turbo is the better option but it can be a very debatable topic with several facets.
Eric
It's also worth mentioning you are now eliminating any power lost from actually running the supercharger being that turbos use expelled energy to create their power rather than a supercharger which uses HP to make HP.
In my personal opinion any way you slice it a turbo is the better option but it can be a very debatable topic with several facets.
Eric
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1967 Pro Touring turbo LSX Camaro
Not to mention that the exhaust side of the turbos can be sized to change the boost characteristics to your liking, and a good EBC can help keep the pressure where you want it on the cold side.
Like you said, there's a few pros and cons of each, but turbo lag isn't an issue if you don't want it to be.
Like you said, there's a few pros and cons of each, but turbo lag isn't an issue if you don't want it to be.
To me a turbocharger will actually give you more usable power, especially in the case of a RWD car. Having low end torque is GREAT but too much (as is the case in the E55) is really sort of useless unless your end goal is to kill tires. That lag will actually create a faster car as the tires can actually hold the power down low and be less likely to break loose while already at speed.
It's also worth mentioning you are now eliminating any power lost from actually running the supercharger being that turbos use expelled energy to create their power rather than a supercharger which uses HP to make HP.
In my personal opinion any way you slice it a turbo is the better option but it can be a very debatable topic with several facets.
Eric
It's also worth mentioning you are now eliminating any power lost from actually running the supercharger being that turbos use expelled energy to create their power rather than a supercharger which uses HP to make HP.
In my personal opinion any way you slice it a turbo is the better option but it can be a very debatable topic with several facets.
Eric
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300ce
......I saw this, but didn't think it was serious. I'd prefer the conversation to be on the open forum, so that for me and for the tuner there will be no he said, she said. The content of the legal contract will also be on the open forum. It's best out in the open because there has been too much bs regarding this issue.
.......AMS have pulled out and they did this on the open forum. I thank them for stepping up on the open forum and admitting they are unable to do it. What I urge now, is for them once and forever, stop the talking.
......also I want to be clear, I don't think this is impossible to do. I just think we in the Mercedes Benz world with possible exception of kleemann, Brabus and perhaps renntech, we don't have the same caliber of tuners as other car makes. We just have tuners that talk a good game. Enough with the bs!
Ted
Last edited by Ted Baldwin; Feb 23, 2013 at 07:30 AM.
