There have simply been too many blown motors due to unsafe tuning from a few different companies. It needs to stop. I have done ECU analysis of blown motors 7 times just this last summer from customers with other tunes, and that is too many. We need to realize where the power limit is on the car, and take a step back to appreciate what the purpose of Mercedes tuning is for. The AMG platform is wonderful because it can provide us with a daily driver that is smooth enough to carry grandma in the car, but absolutely fast enough to destroy most of the cars on the road with just a few modifications. This should be the way that the tune is done on the car. Safety and longevity in mind above the absurd race for the biggest HP numbers. I strongly believe that the limit of these motors has been pushed time and time again, and people who are just looking to make a fast car faster end up with a mountain of troubles because of it. Years ago, blown motors started showing up and the solution was to always blame something mechanical on the car, when in fact it was due to the tune. These cars are not testing a new motor design, or R&D a new type of product. Most of the horror stories I see, and provide ECU analysis for, have simple modifications, such as a s/c pulley or headers. These customers are left with horrible experiences costing them huge amounts of time and money to fix, and it scars them from modifying cars in the future. At the time of writing this post, Logic Lab Tuning has sold over 100 Mercedes tunes without an engine failure of any kind at all. The reason for this is simple. We do not run an additional 8 degree of timing on top of the factory maps, we do not lean out the fuel mixture to gain every last bit of HP that the car has to give, and most importantly, leave the Mercedes safeguard coding in the ECU in place so that if there is a mechanical failure the ECU can compensate for it.

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On another note. The MyGenius unit that people have been purchasing is a wonderful unit that we have had excellent success with. If you have a unit from another tuner that you find is not operating, let us know and we can probably fix it. It takes a lot of work from the side of the tuner to have these units properly set up and working correctly.

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Thanks
Aleks

 

Hey Aleks it's Tom, I was wondering if Chris contacted you about going to the track this Saturday (Byron and weather permitting). We could use some on the spot tuning

 

I don't have LogicLab but a custom tune from Aleks, I vouch for it! Car runs like a champ and has for the last 2 years since the tune!

 

What kind of gains are you proposing with your tunes? Is the advertised tune through the portable flash/MyGenius handheld?

 

oh give me a break. Tuners always claim that they've reviewed the other guys' tunes and that they are "crazy", "way too aggressive", or "don't know what they're doing". Then comes the, "but we have sixty billion years of experience tuning x,y,z with not a single failure and we are only doing tunes that don't blow up".

Then comes everybody saying, "yeah, they're the best". A year later, 3 guys blew motors, five think the car runs like crap, and a dozen more find another tuner they think is better.

ENOUGH.

let the tunes do the talking. If you're still around in five years, then maybe you're doing something worthwhile.

 

I am out of town this weekend, but next week I would love to go!

Hey Man! I have not seen you in forever, we need to go out for a drive.

Gains are dependent on the mods on your car All of the tunes work with the MyGenius unit and can be changed on the fly without a laptop at any time.

You are 100% right. People need to do their own research and decide which tuner to go with.

 

alot of it is driver and heat, You should all know how weak a 5.4l ford lightning motor can be i ran 8degs over factory timing and added a blower 10psi more that factory and the new owner of my truck has 0 problems.

 

It needs to stop indeed. Even relatively fresh engines with factory tuning have been documented to unglue themselves, particularly our cast hypereutectic pistons.

Do your tunes include any warranty against internal parts damage to make purchasers whole, and if so what are its monetary limits? Thanks.

 

Outside of Renntech and Kleeman who may possibly offer this, but I doubt it. In 15 years of modding cars I have never heard of a company offering this. I believe this is where the creedo "Pay to Play" comes from, to some extent.

 

Apology in advance for derailing this thread, but...a spot on tune can only do so much. At some point the stress is simply beyond what stock parts can handle.

You ran a stock connecting rod Lightning motor at 18#'s of boost and in the 20+ range on timing and it survived a WOT pull? On pump gas????

Having just sold my Lightning that I bought brand new, built/modded over the past 9 years, and having been heavily involved in the Lightning community including tuning and modding them I'm going to have to call on this. 18#'s of boost on a stock rod Lightning would require a conservative tune even on C-16 to survive.

Who did the tune? What kind of timing were you actually seeing on the datalogs?

FWIW I ran 20#'s of boost on the street with my built L but only 11* of timing with a 94-5 octane blend for fuel and made 618/662 @ the tire. C-16 tune @21#'s only ran 17* of timing and made 697/734 RWHP/TQ. But there were a lot of mods that went into my build to allow it to survive, that is not going to hapen on a stock rodded '99 L motor.

Dyno sheet of my c-16 vs 90 octane (15#, 9* timing) winter tune.

 

I vouch for logic lab tuning I seen a lot of blown motors in person from other companies. Some companies are pushing our cars engines to the extreme limit. A lot of you guys might not see any damage for a while but in the long run it's destroying the cars engine. I have logic lab tuning and I'm happy with it extremely happy with it. Aleks you need to come to houston soon so you can do a dyno tune for me. I love your flash tune that I got from Ted at m power can't wait for your dyno tune

 

i tune sct,disco here from lightning rodder i had the 99 stock block magnum powers truck 4lb pulley 11.69 truck yup street i ran 15 or 16 deg and race tune 104octane was 18deg.

 

I don't think the tuners are pushing us, I think it is that WE are pushing them, and pushing the limits of our cars. Its been that way since the 50's.. Get it to the edge of the envelope without going over. Some do.

And PS - engines that are not tuned blow up. I see a LOT of E55's with 20-40K miles. Really? And no service records. I think some of those cars have over 100K, and they have been rolled back. So a 40K motor, modded, may not be exactly that.

I really had to fight with my last tuner to take out some fuel. I was running 10.1 up top. I wanted 11.1 at least

So welcome. The tuner debate has always been contentious here. 100 tunes is actually pretty small. But that does not mean you don't know what your are doing, it just doesn't say: We really know what we are doing. That is at the 1000 mark

 

I heard from a "big name" tuner that they believe another tuner, that we all know, tends to "push" their tune for the big #'s they see. so who is right?

 

has anybody actually put an EGT sensor on the #8 cylinder to see if the EGT's are within check to run xx amount of timing with xx IAT's

There is nothing wrong with tuning on the ragged edge to eek out the last few HP. (think NHRA) they tear down the motors almost every pass too check on things and I am sure there tunes are spot on and their motor let go also. it's racing.

Until you can have hard data proof of what your claiming to be bad, it's just that, speculation. Have you Logic Lab, logged a car with EGT in #8 cylinder and see where a safe rise in EGT vs timing is for various boost pressures and IAT's? Is #8 letting go due to a lean condition or EGT condition they both cause heat in the combustion chamber and destroy things

 

beating on a car with aircharge temps well over a 100deg is prob the worse thing you can do.

 

I just keep getting pictures like this over and over again. Make sure that you are checking on your car and tune to keep you from having to get a new motor!

 

I am having the infamous 82mm throttle body hiccup. The car will go into a mini limp mode with a map sensor code but will not set a check engine light. Reset the key and all is well. Only does this at very light throttle and going up a hill.

If you can verify that your tune will fix this, ill buy one.

 

+1

 

Seeing this stuff makes me not get my new to me toy tuned. This exact reason is why I got rid of my 335 as I had nothing but issues with it after a tune. I am relatively close to Chicago. Where is your shop located? I have tried finding your place on google but nothing comes up. I'd like to see the shop and meet whom ever will be doing by tuning if I go through with it. No more blind sending ecu off in the mail for me.

 

I suspect that many blown motors (mine included) are attributable to lean spikes while the car is in hiccup mode. Owners who weren't specifically monitoring AFRs at the time would be none the wiser

 

If your in Chicago, id suggest speedriven. I have gone there for maintenance and performance alike.

 

Thnx for the tip. I have only been on here for a few days as I very recently got into a MB. I will look them up. Still snooping around on the forum and trying to see what is what around here. I'm not in Chicago, about 2 hours straight north into Packers country.

 

I am currently working with Aleks on a tune for the UPD fixed s/c pulley. I just loaded up a new version yesterday and will be doing about 120 miles tomorrow. Will keep everyone updated with our progress.

 

To date, no one has ever been able to fix that problem. I have an MB 82mm TB and never had an issue. many, many others have had the issue. All with a larger throttle bodies. It seems more frequent on non-MB TB's but even some of those do it. I am SOOOO glad I never had the issue.