Oil pump solenoids
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
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04 E55 AMG (totaled), 07 S550 4Matic, 14 E63S
Yup, I can make it stall on a steep enough grade if I leave the car parked outside overnight and the morning temps are cold enough even with about 3 minutes of warm-up/idle.
Interestingly, it doesn't occur if I have the sensor plugged in and drive it under the same conditions, if the sensor is unplugged but the car is parked in my garage overnight, or if I drive the car around the neighborhood for a bit before hitting that same hill.
Only when the car is too cold/outside overnight, temps are low enough at time of driving, the sensor is unplugged does do this only once. Also interestingly, it doesn't re-occur unless the car sits overnight. I have to deliberately recreate those conditions to do it. If the sensor is plugged in, I can't recreate this.
If this changes before I leave the country, I'll report back.
Interestingly, it doesn't occur if I have the sensor plugged in and drive it under the same conditions, if the sensor is unplugged but the car is parked in my garage overnight, or if I drive the car around the neighborhood for a bit before hitting that same hill.
Only when the car is too cold/outside overnight, temps are low enough at time of driving, the sensor is unplugged does do this only once. Also interestingly, it doesn't re-occur unless the car sits overnight. I have to deliberately recreate those conditions to do it. If the sensor is plugged in, I can't recreate this.
If this changes before I leave the country, I'll report back.
Solenoid unplugged
Cold soak overnight (not in the garage). What outside temp?
Your car is cold started and driven ~3 minutes
You stop on a hill, in drive, but not moving? Or you are moving?
The engine will........stall? Run rough and then stall? What exactly happens? Coolant temp? Oil temp? Fuel trims, the whole 9.
We need this info.
Last edited by kevm14; Feb 28, 2024 at 11:54 AM.
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2023
Posts: 69
Likes: 44
From: FL
2015 E63 AMG S
Not much to add here but just want to mention that I drive the heck out of my SL63 (perf package, no tune), the solenoid has been unplugged for about 1500 miles, and never once have I had a stalling issue. I do wait for the oil temp to reach proper operating temp before giving it hell, but I’ve been out in sub-30 degree weather and have run it to redline without a single complaint. I pulled the plug (out of the front cover, lol) almost three months ago. We don’t have a many hills here at the
Regarding the stalling issue, it would be good to know what oil pressure is like at startup (and on an incline). Maybe you have a stuck solenoid and the engine is failsafe-ing itself?
Regarding the stalling issue, it would be good to know what oil pressure is like at startup (and on an incline). Maybe you have a stuck solenoid and the engine is failsafe-ing itself?
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 745
Likes: 139
14 E63, 05 E55, 03 Evo 8, 08 F250, 06 R6R, 92 Talon TSI, and instability
I don't have a logger, otherwise that would be a non-issue. I do have an sds. When time permits, I'd be happy to scan for codes. However, it hasn't thrown a check engine light when it does it.
Frankly, I did not go looking for or expecting to find this. This was an absolutely unexpected finding on my part. I simply plugged the sensor back in to rule it out as my problem fully expecting there to be more, and not expecting the sensor to fix my problem. Me repeating the experiment over days on end was me saying "this has to be a fluke". I'm more shocked than anything that it wasn't.
I'm otherwise happy with this mod. Overall, the car feels better.
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 7,847
Likes: 3,496
From: Maryland
2015 SL400 (M276 Turbo), 2014 C350 Sport (M276 NA), 2004 SL500 (M113), 2004 Audi TT225 (BEA)
I'm quoting myself from back at the very beginning of the conversation to reinforce why I'm making the below commentary. I'd also like to note I've owned my car since 2018, tuned in tuned since 2020 to its current state, and know it's behavior extremely well.
Been hesitating to report this, but I do have a negative behavior associated with the sensor unplugged vs being plugged in. In colder weather (40(s)f and below), when I first drive the car if I don't drive it hard enough for about 5 minutes it'll stall /bog out under high load/low throttle. I've stalled it multiple times on a hill in my neighborhood on the way to work in the morning .
Did the transmission adaption reset, and no change. Replaced my throttle pedal, no change. Out of morbid curiosity, plugged in the sensor and it went away. Unplugged it overnight, it came back.
I'm torn as I feel the pros of having the sensor unplugged outweigh the cons. However, this behavior goes back to what I initially said near the beginning of the thread that I'm hard pressed to believe the sensor doesn't have some other affect associated with it other than just oiling. Clearly it does. Or I shouldn't be able to do this.
What this tells me is the ecu is telling the sensor to reduce/increase oil flow to some extent based on load and temps. While the primary purpose may be emissions and fuel efficiency, that clearly has an effect on low rpm drivability that may need some adjustment in the ecu to compensate for this change.
Been hesitating to report this, but I do have a negative behavior associated with the sensor unplugged vs being plugged in. In colder weather (40(s)f and below), when I first drive the car if I don't drive it hard enough for about 5 minutes it'll stall /bog out under high load/low throttle. I've stalled it multiple times on a hill in my neighborhood on the way to work in the morning .
Did the transmission adaption reset, and no change. Replaced my throttle pedal, no change. Out of morbid curiosity, plugged in the sensor and it went away. Unplugged it overnight, it came back.
I'm torn as I feel the pros of having the sensor unplugged outweigh the cons. However, this behavior goes back to what I initially said near the beginning of the thread that I'm hard pressed to believe the sensor doesn't have some other affect associated with it other than just oiling. Clearly it does. Or I shouldn't be able to do this.
What this tells me is the ecu is telling the sensor to reduce/increase oil flow to some extent based on load and temps. While the primary purpose may be emissions and fuel efficiency, that clearly has an effect on low rpm drivability that may need some adjustment in the ecu to compensate for this change.
As has been noted several times, the solenoid only RESTRICTS normal oil pressure and the failsafe default condition is disabled, meaning normal pressure base on engine speed up to ~60 psi (4 bar). Also, we see TIPS documents that say to ignore the fault.
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 7,847
Likes: 3,496
From: Maryland
2015 SL400 (M276 Turbo), 2014 C350 Sport (M276 NA), 2004 SL500 (M113), 2004 Audi TT225 (BEA)
What I haven't tried is running a ghost sensor to see if that affects behavior. I'm running out of cold temp days and will be unable to do anything more with the car beyond driving it as I'm leaving the country for a while due to work. Someone else would have to try it and report on that one.
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From: US
2008 E350, 2012 ML350, 2014 E350, 2015 ML350
Time out. Are you actually saying my own findings, which are in a small part in contrast to the overwhelming "perfection" that this mod has claimed to be, have no value because I cannot recreate everyone else's level of modifications?
Last time I checked, NO ONE in the thread has been held to that standard let alone have the abilities to recreate every weather, temperature, and load condition. Heck, no one has yet to put the car on a steady state dyno and do a full before and after comparison of normal driving under varying temperatures , load and throttle.
If you REALLY want to go there, then let's go there and say nothing presented in this entire thread is conclusive to the community because none of that has happened.
Otherwise, let's take my findings for what they are, a point of data for the pool as an area for folks to either explore more in-depth or just add to the overall input so far.
Sorry I found a side effect I wasn't looking for or expected. Sorry I put in my time to experiment further. Sorry I could recreate my findings under limited conditions. Sorry the mod everyone loves probably isn't perfect.
Last time I checked, NO ONE in the thread has been held to that standard let alone have the abilities to recreate every weather, temperature, and load condition. Heck, no one has yet to put the car on a steady state dyno and do a full before and after comparison of normal driving under varying temperatures , load and throttle.
If you REALLY want to go there, then let's go there and say nothing presented in this entire thread is conclusive to the community because none of that has happened.
Otherwise, let's take my findings for what they are, a point of data for the pool as an area for folks to either explore more in-depth or just add to the overall input so far.
Sorry I found a side effect I wasn't looking for or expected. Sorry I put in my time to experiment further. Sorry I could recreate my findings under limited conditions. Sorry the mod everyone loves probably isn't perfect.
What I meant is that more tests are required since there are now 2 variables involved in your case. If we do not complete "all the tests", it is difficult to conclude, only a possible cause. That is all. I also understand that the tune being flashed, and non-removable, the other tests are not possible preventing us from concluding something. It becomes antoher data point for the analysis
A similar argument we had with the true CEL, and no CEL differences. After understanding that some cars have the oil pressure sensor, we sorted out that issue.
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2023
Posts: 69
Likes: 44
From: FL
2015 E63 AMG S
I do mind humoring you, so no.
I don't have a logger, otherwise that would be a non-issue. I do have an sds. When time permits, I'd be happy to scan for codes. However, it hasn't thrown a check engine light when it does it.
Frankly, I did not go looking for or expecting to find this. This was an absolutely unexpected finding on my part. I simply plugged the sensor back in to rule it out as my problem fully expecting there to be more, and not expecting the sensor to fix my problem. Me repeating the experiment over days on end was me saying "this has to be a fluke". I'm more shocked than anything that it wasn't.
I'm otherwise happy with this mod. Overall, the car feels better.
I don't have a logger, otherwise that would be a non-issue. I do have an sds. When time permits, I'd be happy to scan for codes. However, it hasn't thrown a check engine light when it does it.
Frankly, I did not go looking for or expecting to find this. This was an absolutely unexpected finding on my part. I simply plugged the sensor back in to rule it out as my problem fully expecting there to be more, and not expecting the sensor to fix my problem. Me repeating the experiment over days on end was me saying "this has to be a fluke". I'm more shocked than anything that it wasn't.
I'm otherwise happy with this mod. Overall, the car feels better.
If you're going to blow that off, which it sounds like you will, I'd at least buy a dummy solenoid and try to replicate it.
At the minimum check your oil level.
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 7,847
Likes: 3,496
From: Maryland
2015 SL400 (M276 Turbo), 2014 C350 Sport (M276 NA), 2004 SL500 (M113), 2004 Audi TT225 (BEA)
Anecdotally, @WANTED!! has observed symptoms that lead him to believe the solenoid mod is causing the strange behavior. He has decided to share that observation. Quite a few responses seem adversarial, or at least defensive, though I don't think they are meant to be. Group hug?
I do believe that while unplugging the solenoid is a cause of this behavior, it may not be the root or only cause, but has somehow amplified a hidden problem or problems that need to be investigated. Just because a problem does not trigger a CEL does not mean there is not a code waiting to be uncovered. The P06DA00 is a perfect example. CELs are only triggered if the fault has a direct affect on emissions--they do NOT alert on every problem. That's why waiting for a CEL is not a good idea. Get a proper Mercedes scanner and know for sure.
I do believe that while unplugging the solenoid is a cause of this behavior, it may not be the root or only cause, but has somehow amplified a hidden problem or problems that need to be investigated. Just because a problem does not trigger a CEL does not mean there is not a code waiting to be uncovered. The P06DA00 is a perfect example. CELs are only triggered if the fault has a direct affect on emissions--they do NOT alert on every problem. That's why waiting for a CEL is not a good idea. Get a proper Mercedes scanner and know for sure.
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Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2023
Posts: 69
Likes: 44
From: FL
2015 E63 AMG S
Anecdotally, @WANTED!! has observed symptoms that lead him to believe the solenoid mod is causing the strange behavior. He has decided to share that observation. Quite a few responses seem adversarial, or at least defensive, though I don't think they are meant to be. Group hug?
I do believe that while unplugging the solenoid is a cause of this behavior, it may not be the root or only cause, but has somehow amplified hidden problem that needs to be investigated. Just because a problem does not trigger a CEL does not mean there is not a code waiting to be uncovered. The P06DA00 is a perfect example. CELs are only triggered if the fault has a direct affect on emissions--they do NOT alert on every problem. That's why waiting for a CEL is not a good idea. Get a proper Mercedes scanner and know for sure.
I do believe that while unplugging the solenoid is a cause of this behavior, it may not be the root or only cause, but has somehow amplified hidden problem that needs to be investigated. Just because a problem does not trigger a CEL does not mean there is not a code waiting to be uncovered. The P06DA00 is a perfect example. CELs are only triggered if the fault has a direct affect on emissions--they do NOT alert on every problem. That's why waiting for a CEL is not a good idea. Get a proper Mercedes scanner and know for sure.
Super Member
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 745
Likes: 139
14 E63, 05 E55, 03 Evo 8, 08 F250, 06 R6R, 92 Talon TSI, and instability
Anecdotally, @WANTED!! has observed symptoms that lead him to believe the solenoid mod is causing the strange behavior. He has decided to share that observation. Quite a few responses seem adversarial, or at least defensive, though I don't think they are meant to be. Group hug?
I do believe that while unplugging the solenoid is a cause of this behavior, it may not be the root or only cause, but has somehow amplified a hidden problem or problems that need to be investigated. Just because a problem does not trigger a CEL does not mean there is not a code waiting to be uncovered. The P06DA00 is a perfect example. CELs are only triggered if the fault has a direct affect on emissions--they do NOT alert on every problem. That's why waiting for a CEL is not a good idea. Get a proper Mercedes scanner and know for sure.
I do believe that while unplugging the solenoid is a cause of this behavior, it may not be the root or only cause, but has somehow amplified a hidden problem or problems that need to be investigated. Just because a problem does not trigger a CEL does not mean there is not a code waiting to be uncovered. The P06DA00 is a perfect example. CELs are only triggered if the fault has a direct affect on emissions--they do NOT alert on every problem. That's why waiting for a CEL is not a good idea. Get a proper Mercedes scanner and know for sure.
Last edited by WANTED!!; Feb 28, 2024 at 12:34 PM.
Member
Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 182
Likes: 70
From: Jersey City
S63 Coupe
Apologies if it came across that way. Nobody here is being held to any standard.
What I meant is that more tests are required since there are now 2 variables involved in your case. If we do not complete "all the tests", it is difficult to conclude, only a possible cause. That is all. I also understand that the tune being flashed, and non-removable, the other tests are not possible preventing us from concluding something. It becomes antoher data point for the analysis
A similar argument we had with the true CEL, and no CEL differences. After understanding that some cars have the oil pressure sensor, we sorted out that issue.
What I meant is that more tests are required since there are now 2 variables involved in your case. If we do not complete "all the tests", it is difficult to conclude, only a possible cause. That is all. I also understand that the tune being flashed, and non-removable, the other tests are not possible preventing us from concluding something. It becomes antoher data point for the analysis
A similar argument we had with the true CEL, and no CEL differences. After understanding that some cars have the oil pressure sensor, we sorted out that issue.
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 7,847
Likes: 3,496
From: Maryland
2015 SL400 (M276 Turbo), 2014 C350 Sport (M276 NA), 2004 SL500 (M113), 2004 Audi TT225 (BEA)
To be accurate, adding a dummy solenoid eliminates the ECU setting a code for a malfunctioning (missing) solenoid; it does not bypass anything. With the dummy solenoid, the ECU thinks everything is hunky-dory. A Check Engine Light indicates a malfunction that pollutes the air. Because P06DA00 does not trip the CEL, emissions are not affected.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2020
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04 E55 AMG (totaled), 07 S550 4Matic, 14 E63S
I think the statement is, we don't know why the vehicles with oil pressure sensors trigger a CEL for P06DA00 when the other vehicles just have the silent code. What part about having an oil pressure sensor makes it an emissions issue? It could be that there is some arcane rule in OBD-II land where IF you sense engine oil pressure, engine oil pressure related codes have to illuminate the CEL. I could see that. It means literally nothing though, and is of no consequence to this mod.
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Joined: Nov 2023
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From: Virginia Beach
R231 SL 63
Maybe a bad spark plug at startup? Fouled?
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
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04 E55 AMG (totaled), 07 S550 4Matic, 14 E63S
It could also just be hitting closed loop 45 seconds into a cold start, to cause a change in idle/sound. Or the catalyst warmup idea I had earlier.
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From: Atlanta GA
2012 E350 Cabriolet now SOLD to my son
Junior Member
Joined: Feb 2024
Posts: 45
Likes: 12
AMG A45 / W176
Hi mates,
my Car w176 AMG A45 MJ2017 facelift stock
i got this code P06DA00 by 53k miles and drove without any problems 10k miles now. If i dont have any scanner "Prodiag"
I would never have known. My oldschool mechanic told me to repair this for 600€
Can i ignore this code for my car too ?
my Car w176 AMG A45 MJ2017 facelift stock
i got this code P06DA00 by 53k miles and drove without any problems 10k miles now. If i dont have any scanner "Prodiag"
I would never have known. My oldschool mechanic told me to repair this for 600€
Can i ignore this code for my car too ?
Last edited by Lotty; Feb 28, 2024 at 05:13 PM.
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 11,923
Likes: 6,776
From: Silicon Valley
W212 MY'14 M276-3.5NA @75kMi
lucky defect
Hi mates,
my Car w176 AMG A45 MJ2017 facelift stock
i got this code P06DA00 by 53k miles and drove without any problems 10k miles now. If i dont have any scanner "Prodiag"
I would never have known. My oldschool mechanic told me to repair this for 600€
Can i ignore this code for my car too ?
my Car w176 AMG A45 MJ2017 facelift stock
i got this code P06DA00 by 53k miles and drove without any problems 10k miles now. If i dont have any scanner "Prodiag"
I would never have known. My oldschool mechanic told me to repair this for 600€
Can i ignore this code for my car too ?
Many cars with this code have a harness defect that perfectly disables the low oil pressure, the way we like.
Even for free I would not get my oil pump fixed to enable low pressure!!
Junior Member
Joined: Feb 2024
Posts: 45
Likes: 12
AMG A45 / W176
Normally this P06DA00 code is the lucky one everyone here wish they had without having to unplug...
Many cars with this code have a harness defect that perfectly disables the low oil pressure, the way we like.
Even for free I would not get my oil pump fixed to enable low pressure!!
Many cars with this code have a harness defect that perfectly disables the low oil pressure, the way we like.
Even for free I would not get my oil pump fixed to enable low pressure!!
Member
Joined: Aug 2022
Posts: 78
Likes: 60
From: Toronto
2014 E63s AMG
I do mind humoring you, so no.
I don't have a logger, otherwise that would be a non-issue. I do have an sds. When time permits, I'd be happy to scan for codes. However, it hasn't thrown a check engine light when it does it.
Frankly, I did not go looking for or expecting to find this. This was an absolutely unexpected finding on my part. I simply plugged the sensor back in to rule it out as my problem fully expecting there to be more, and not expecting the sensor to fix my problem. Me repeating the experiment over days on end was me saying "this has to be a fluke". I'm more shocked than anything that it wasn't.
I'm otherwise happy with this mod. Overall, the car feels better.
I don't have a logger, otherwise that would be a non-issue. I do have an sds. When time permits, I'd be happy to scan for codes. However, it hasn't thrown a check engine light when it does it.
Frankly, I did not go looking for or expecting to find this. This was an absolutely unexpected finding on my part. I simply plugged the sensor back in to rule it out as my problem fully expecting there to be more, and not expecting the sensor to fix my problem. Me repeating the experiment over days on end was me saying "this has to be a fluke". I'm more shocked than anything that it wasn't.
I'm otherwise happy with this mod. Overall, the car feels better.
FWIW I live in a cold climate, have had the solenoid unplugged for months, and have not experienced any stalling or drivability issues. Car is stock.
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 7,847
Likes: 3,496
From: Maryland
2015 SL400 (M276 Turbo), 2014 C350 Sport (M276 NA), 2004 SL500 (M113), 2004 Audi TT225 (BEA)
I think the statement is, we don't know why the vehicles with oil pressure sensors trigger a CEL for P06DA00 when the other vehicles just have the silent code. What part about having an oil pressure sensor makes it an emissions issue? It could be that there is some arcane rule in OBD-II land where IF you sense engine oil pressure, engine oil pressure related codes have to illuminate the CEL. I could see that. It means literally nothing though, and is of no consequence to this mod.
We just don't know for those cars with the oil pressure sensors how the feedback to the ECU works.
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 11,923
Likes: 6,776
From: Silicon Valley
W212 MY'14 M276-3.5NA @75kMi
Neh, thank you!!!
Very much so if your solenoid stays at rest - Do yourself a favor go watch the video in OP#1 at the top: valve got jammed = BAD DAY!
It's safer to unplug this time bomb clean off. Find the time to pull the plug and take couple pictures you'll post in favorite MBWorld chassis board.
Your engine is now ABNORMALLY MORE RELIABLE because you are lucky.
BTW now we can thank you as you have tested this mod longer than all of us combined.
It's safer to unplug this time bomb clean off. Find the time to pull the plug and take couple pictures you'll post in favorite MBWorld chassis board.
Your engine is now ABNORMALLY MORE RELIABLE because you are lucky.
BTW now we can thank you as you have tested this mod longer than all of us combined.
Junior Member
Joined: Feb 2024
Posts: 45
Likes: 12
AMG A45 / W176
Wow i already saw this Video...
I change every 6 months or max 120h my oil. On next service i will unplug this s***
Or i will show tomorrow maybe i can unplug this cable on top. But im sure i need a lifting platform and unplug it from the bottom. IDK.
I change every 6 months or max 120h my oil. On next service i will unplug this s***
Or i will show tomorrow maybe i can unplug this cable on top. But im sure i need a lifting platform and unplug it from the bottom. IDK.
Last edited by Lotty; Feb 28, 2024 at 07:40 PM.
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 7,847
Likes: 3,496
From: Maryland
2015 SL400 (M276 Turbo), 2014 C350 Sport (M276 NA), 2004 SL500 (M113), 2004 Audi TT225 (BEA)
I can't speak for V8 engines, but our V6 engines can be accessed from the top. You just need to remove the intake tube running from the grill to the airbox to reach down and unplug it.
Junior Member
Joined: Feb 2024
Posts: 45
Likes: 12
AMG A45 / W176
