Brake Installation Help!
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From: asdfasdf
One with 4 wheels
Brake Installation Help!
A mechanic buddy of mine and I are going to install my new OEM rotors and Porterfields tomorrow. We're also flushing out the brake fluid and putting in some Valvoline Synpower Synthetic Dot 4 fluid! 
The only thing I'm not sure about is the Brake Sensor. Since the Porter's are going in and I'm not going to be able to use the Brake Sensor function anyway, do we just remove the part and have the "Brake Wear: Visit Workshop" message reset?
Also........what does the Brake Sensor part look like? LOL
Thanks!
The only thing I'm not sure about is the Brake Sensor. Since the Porter's are going in and I'm not going to be able to use the Brake Sensor function anyway, do we just remove the part and have the "Brake Wear: Visit Workshop" message reset?
Also........what does the Brake Sensor part look like? LOL
Thanks!
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Joined: Jul 2006
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From: Orange County, CA
GMC - Miata - Trek - P-Car
get a new sensor and zip tie it out of the way.
Your Porterfield R4-S parts are direct replacements for the OE pads.
Because they have the requisite orifice for the wear sensor, there is no sensible reason not to utilize its worthwhile safety feature.
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Joined: Jan 2005
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From: Orange County
2005 C Wagon (No snickering please!)
STOP!Don't you dare put that Valvoline brake fluid in your car. Don't be a boob, your not driving a Ford. The passeges in the antilock brake system in your Benz are very complex and tiny. Mercedes and Alfred Teves (ATE) worked to formulate a brake fluid of a specific viscosity to assure continued safety and performance of your braking system. The easy place to find this elixer in the US is at your dealer. It should be changed every two years. Not because it is dirty, or because it absorbed water, it is because it absorbs copper, and this reduces the boiling point.
From ATE:
The brake fluid is the most important part of the brake system because it transmits the pressure we apply with our feet to the brakes. Since the introduction of electronic systems like ABS and ESP, the brake fluid has acquired a far greater importance than it had before. The hydraulic units of these systems have a large number of small bores and ducts, some of them smaller in diameter than a human hair. Consequently, the wrong choice of brake fluid can have disastrous results for the operation of state-of-the-art brake systems.
Since the introduction of ESP, brake fluid must decelerate individual wheels in fractions of a second in order to stabilize the vehicle in critical situations (e.g. a skid). The development of particularly thinbodied brake fluids such as Original ATE SL.6 have been essential in ensuring the rapid response times required for ESP can be attained. The requirement for such fluids has already been incorporated into the design of the ESP system. With conventional brake fluids the system's reaction times (in critical situations) may be several times longer than with Original ATE SL.6. In practice this may mean that the system cannot stabilize the vehicle.
Click here to see the graphs of how much faster this fluid works than DOT 4 sauce from everyone else.
http://www.ate-na.com/generator/www/...bf_sl6_us.html
Play it safe, don't use brake fluid that might cripple the ABS or ESP.
From ATE:
The brake fluid is the most important part of the brake system because it transmits the pressure we apply with our feet to the brakes. Since the introduction of electronic systems like ABS and ESP, the brake fluid has acquired a far greater importance than it had before. The hydraulic units of these systems have a large number of small bores and ducts, some of them smaller in diameter than a human hair. Consequently, the wrong choice of brake fluid can have disastrous results for the operation of state-of-the-art brake systems.
Since the introduction of ESP, brake fluid must decelerate individual wheels in fractions of a second in order to stabilize the vehicle in critical situations (e.g. a skid). The development of particularly thinbodied brake fluids such as Original ATE SL.6 have been essential in ensuring the rapid response times required for ESP can be attained. The requirement for such fluids has already been incorporated into the design of the ESP system. With conventional brake fluids the system's reaction times (in critical situations) may be several times longer than with Original ATE SL.6. In practice this may mean that the system cannot stabilize the vehicle.
Click here to see the graphs of how much faster this fluid works than DOT 4 sauce from everyone else.
http://www.ate-na.com/generator/www/...bf_sl6_us.html
Play it safe, don't use brake fluid that might cripple the ABS or ESP.
Last edited by Moviela; Dec 2, 2007 at 03:13 AM.
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From: Orange County
2005 C Wagon (No snickering please!)
The brake wear sensor are from a German company called PEX. They have a plant in FL that makes sensors for the ML, GL, and R class.
http://www.pex.de/en/products/pex-ca...ear-indicator/
I notice in the headine on this page even the Germans have trouble with the difference between brake and break. Ja?
http://www.pex.de/en/products/pex-ca...ear-indicator/
I notice in the headine on this page even the Germans have trouble with the difference between brake and break. Ja?
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Joined: Mar 2006
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From: Boston
2004 C32 ///AMG
Nonsense.
Your Porterfield R4-S parts are direct replacements for the OE pads.
Because they have the requisite orifice for the wear sensor, there is no sensible reason not to utilize its worthwhile safety feature.
Your Porterfield R4-S parts are direct replacements for the OE pads.
Because they have the requisite orifice for the wear sensor, there is no sensible reason not to utilize its worthwhile safety feature.
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Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2005
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From: asdfasdf
One with 4 wheels
Good thing I read the replies before putting in the crap Valvoline! Thanks Moviela!
A lot of forum buddies who have the R4-S's say that the Porter's doesn't allow the use of the Brake Sensor because it has no hole? So my question is, would it be okay to just remove the sensor entirely, since it's not able to use it anyway?
A lot of forum buddies who have the R4-S's say that the Porter's doesn't allow the use of the Brake Sensor because it has no hole? So my question is, would it be okay to just remove the sensor entirely, since it's not able to use it anyway?
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,158
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From: asdfasdf
One with 4 wheels
STOP!Don't you dare put that Valvoline brake fluid in your car. Don't be a boob, your not driving a Ford. The passeges in the antilock brake system in your Benz are very complex and tiny. Mercedes and Alfred Teves (ATE) worked to formulate a brake fluid of a specific viscosity to assure continued safety and performance of your braking system. The easy place to find this elixer in the US is at your dealer. It should be changed every two years. Not because it is dirty, or because it absorbed water, it is because it absorbs copper, and this reduces the boiling point.
From ATE:
The brake fluid is the most important part of the brake system because it transmits the pressure we apply with our feet to the brakes. Since the introduction of electronic systems like ABS and ESP, the brake fluid has acquired a far greater importance than it had before. The hydraulic units of these systems have a large number of small bores and ducts, some of them smaller in diameter than a human hair. Consequently, the wrong choice of brake fluid can have disastrous results for the operation of state-of-the-art brake systems.
Since the introduction of ESP, brake fluid must decelerate individual wheels in fractions of a second in order to stabilize the vehicle in critical situations (e.g. a skid). The development of particularly thinbodied brake fluids such as Original ATE SL.6 have been essential in ensuring the rapid response times required for ESP can be attained. The requirement for such fluids has already been incorporated into the design of the ESP system. With conventional brake fluids the system's reaction times (in critical situations) may be several times longer than with Original ATE SL.6. In practice this may mean that the system cannot stabilize the vehicle.
Click here to see the graphs of how much faster this fluid works than DOT 4 sauce from everyone else.
http://www.ate-na.com/generator/www/...bf_sl6_us.html
Play it safe, don't use brake fluid that might cripple the ABS or ESP.
From ATE:
The brake fluid is the most important part of the brake system because it transmits the pressure we apply with our feet to the brakes. Since the introduction of electronic systems like ABS and ESP, the brake fluid has acquired a far greater importance than it had before. The hydraulic units of these systems have a large number of small bores and ducts, some of them smaller in diameter than a human hair. Consequently, the wrong choice of brake fluid can have disastrous results for the operation of state-of-the-art brake systems.
Since the introduction of ESP, brake fluid must decelerate individual wheels in fractions of a second in order to stabilize the vehicle in critical situations (e.g. a skid). The development of particularly thinbodied brake fluids such as Original ATE SL.6 have been essential in ensuring the rapid response times required for ESP can be attained. The requirement for such fluids has already been incorporated into the design of the ESP system. With conventional brake fluids the system's reaction times (in critical situations) may be several times longer than with Original ATE SL.6. In practice this may mean that the system cannot stabilize the vehicle.
Click here to see the graphs of how much faster this fluid works than DOT 4 sauce from everyone else.
http://www.ate-na.com/generator/www/...bf_sl6_us.html
Play it safe, don't use brake fluid that might cripple the ABS or ESP.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 6,665
Likes: 4
From: Boston
2004 C32 ///AMG
Good thing I read the replies before putting in the crap Valvoline! Thanks Moviela!
A lot of forum buddies who have the R4-S's say that the Porter's doesn't allow the use of the Brake Sensor because it has no hole? So my question is, would it be okay to just remove the sensor entirely, since it's not able to use it anyway?
A lot of forum buddies who have the R4-S's say that the Porter's doesn't allow the use of the Brake Sensor because it has no hole? So my question is, would it be okay to just remove the sensor entirely, since it's not able to use it anyway?
Thread Starter
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From: asdfasdf
One with 4 wheels
So can I just use the existing brake sensor and just zip tie it, or do I have to get a new one?
Man, this is getting complicated. lol
Is there a thread with a good write-up for brake installations anywhere?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 6,665
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From: Boston
2004 C32 ///AMG
if not, you can re-use the sensor if the warning light did not come on yet.
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Joined: Jan 2005
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From: Orange County
2005 C Wagon (No snickering please!)
I am not a huge fan of using competition brake pads on street cars, because there are drawbacks, like harder pedal effort (not a problem for you guys, but a 100 lb lady might bend the nose), faster wear, and increased heat that cooks calipers and rotors faster than stock equipment. That said, if you insist, I don't see why you should not have it.
Sometimes the sensor can be gently removed from the old pad, but usually the heat sorta makes it stick in the hole. They are only 5 bucks, so buy a new one. If there is no hole in the new pad, slap it in a vise and drill one. Just measure the hole size and dimension with respect to the back plate. For depth, measure the hole on a pad you remove, and put a piece of tape around the drill bit at that depth.
The car reads the sensor to see if it is there, and then it checks to see if it has been worn through by the rotor. You can't just leave it off. The car will complain. I can't stand a complaining car. I keep a bottle of washer fluid in the back incase I get a complaint on the way home from the barber shop.
You can install the sensor and store it out of the way, but that would be like racing with your helmet on the seat next to you. Not a good idea.
Call Porterfield, they may have some advise on how to drill the hole, or a reason why you should not drill. If the friction material is really hard, you mght need a special angle drill, or a special coolant to avoid cracking the pad.
Sometimes the sensor can be gently removed from the old pad, but usually the heat sorta makes it stick in the hole. They are only 5 bucks, so buy a new one. If there is no hole in the new pad, slap it in a vise and drill one. Just measure the hole size and dimension with respect to the back plate. For depth, measure the hole on a pad you remove, and put a piece of tape around the drill bit at that depth.
The car reads the sensor to see if it is there, and then it checks to see if it has been worn through by the rotor. You can't just leave it off. The car will complain. I can't stand a complaining car. I keep a bottle of washer fluid in the back incase I get a complaint on the way home from the barber shop.
You can install the sensor and store it out of the way, but that would be like racing with your helmet on the seat next to you. Not a good idea.
Call Porterfield, they may have some advise on how to drill the hole, or a reason why you should not drill. If the friction material is really hard, you mght need a special angle drill, or a special coolant to avoid cracking the pad.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2005
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From: asdfasdf
One with 4 wheels
I am not a huge fan of using competition brake pads on street cars, because there are drawbacks, like harder pedal effort (not a problem for you guys, but a 100 lb lady might bend the nose), faster wear, and increased heat that cooks calipers and rotors faster than stock equipment. That said, if you insist, I don't see why you should not have it.
Sometimes the sensor can be gently removed from the old pad, but usually the heat sorta makes it stick in the hole. They are only 5 bucks, so buy a new one. If there is no hole in the new pad, slap it in a vise and drill one. Just measure the hole size and dimension with respect to the back plate. For depth, measure the hole on a pad you remove, and put a piece of tape around the drill bit at that depth.
The car reads the sensor to see if it is there, and then it checks to see if it has been worn through by the rotor. You can't just leave it off. The car will complain. I can't stand a complaining car. I keep a bottle of washer fluid in the back incase I get a complaint on the way home from the barber shop.
You can install the sensor and store it out of the way, but that would be like racing with your helmet on the seat next to you. Not a good idea.
Call Porterfield, they may have some advise on how to drill the hole, or a reason why you should not drill. If the friction material is really hard, you mght need a special angle drill, or a special coolant to avoid cracking the pad.
Sometimes the sensor can be gently removed from the old pad, but usually the heat sorta makes it stick in the hole. They are only 5 bucks, so buy a new one. If there is no hole in the new pad, slap it in a vise and drill one. Just measure the hole size and dimension with respect to the back plate. For depth, measure the hole on a pad you remove, and put a piece of tape around the drill bit at that depth.
The car reads the sensor to see if it is there, and then it checks to see if it has been worn through by the rotor. You can't just leave it off. The car will complain. I can't stand a complaining car. I keep a bottle of washer fluid in the back incase I get a complaint on the way home from the barber shop.
You can install the sensor and store it out of the way, but that would be like racing with your helmet on the seat next to you. Not a good idea.
Call Porterfield, they may have some advise on how to drill the hole, or a reason why you should not drill. If the friction material is really hard, you mght need a special angle drill, or a special coolant to avoid cracking the pad.
I think I'm most likely just going to zip-tie it.
Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 140
Likes: 1
From: central cali
2005 C230 SS, 2000 1.8t Passat, Crown Vic with lights on roof
I recently replaced my front pads and flushed out the old brake fluid on my 05C230SS, replaced it with ATE "SuperBlue" fluid, is this brake fluid ok to use?
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,717
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From: San Jose, CA
2007 E63 w/P30 and Eurotech CF Diffuser
Looking at the viscosity difference on the ATE site, I would say you should change your fluid again
http://www.ate-na.com/generator/www/...f_info_us.html
http://www.ate-na.com/generator/www/...f_info_us.html
