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Dual Exhaust on C250

 
Old 12-21-2011, 12:14 AM
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2012 C250 Coupe
Question Dual Exhaust on C250

Hey guys, I've been convinced by my dealership to turn in my 2009 c300 4matic and get a 2012 c-coupe. I am just a little stuck right now between c350 and c250. Unfortunately, I won't be able to get 4matic in April as I can't wait that long and still get this amazing opportunity/deal. But between my Continental Extreme Contact DWS I have, and the ability to use another highly winter capable car if it gets really bad and I need to get somewhere, I think I'm over that issue.

Now its just c250 vs c350. I am definitely getting the P1 package, so it brings the actual cost difference to about 3k. But the money isn't really the issue. The power of the c250 is more than ample for me, but the thing that irks me is the single exhaust tip outlet. Does anyone know the feasibility of retrofitting dual exhaust onto a 2012 C250.

I am not really familiar with turbo cars and if you would be able to do this, as the turbo runs off the exhaust. But I would assume it pulls from the exhaust pre-cat, so that I will be free to add an x-pipe and then add additional piping and tips to the rear of the car and a new diffuser to get true dual exhaust. But will this effect anything?

Ideally I would like to add x-pipe and have quad exhaust tips with c63 diffuser. I am not sure what the x-pipe will do to the exhaust tone of a 4-cylinder. Also, I like the idea of straight-pipes, but again, might sound REALLY ricey on a 4-cylinder. But this would simplify having the install but not having to mount hangers (as I would assume the C250 wouldn't come with hangers on the passenger side) so I would just have to mount a hanger for the pipe. I currently have this setup on my car and love it though, so I would really like for the ability to do this.

But I don't know if back pressure is vital on turbo cars. I'm sure I can get away with dual exhaust, but probably not straight pipes (aside from the possibility of sounding like crap). I am not interested in opinions, more facts on feasibility of this?

If not, then I would probably just pony up for a c350 and be done with it, but this will probably force me to exclude other options I was looking to get (such as command, bi-xenons and keyless go).

Any help?

Last edited by jctevere; 12-21-2011 at 12:27 AM.
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Old 12-21-2011, 01:21 AM
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Old 12-21-2011, 01:23 PM
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Old 12-21-2011, 01:23 PM
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Old 12-21-2011, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Petje View Post
those tips look ricey and non-OEM?
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Old 12-21-2011, 04:30 PM
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As people have posted it's easily done. You've asked about x-pipes and that's going to be irrelevant to this i-4 engine since you're not going to be x-ing two cylinder banks. X pipes and h pipes are for balancing out cylinder pulses. Our setup is a downpipe with integrated cat down to a single pipe out the rear. You can y off of that single pipe and be fine. Turbos do fine with very open exhausts so just make sure not to add restriction. If you are concerned with warranty and doing this for looks you may want to just do a "dummy" setup. That would ensure no powertrain warranty problems and also ensure no performance impairments.
Cheers! Mike
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Old 12-21-2011, 04:37 PM
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jct - turbo cars are particularly fussy on back pressure. However going to a simple dual or quad would not have to disturb that. The only real problem is that turbo's, being exhaust driven can make an open exhaust sound like a bit of a wet fart.

Good luck! You will love the Coupe.
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Old 12-21-2011, 05:01 PM
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Sorry, bhvrdr & I posted at the same time. I did not see his post. We appear to disagree but don't in fact.

Turbo engines require very carefully controlled back pressure upstream of the turbo correctly spec'ed for the specific turbo & rev range & throttling by throttle plates on the inlet (so as not to choke the turbo on over run). Downstream of the turbo you want low backpressure & no fancy messing with the exhaust. Keep it simple and open.

In some circumstances too wide open does not help. When running a race team many years back with Turbo Audi's we found that totally wide open (drainpipe) seemed to have an adverse effect on upstream scavenging - while a simple open exhaust downstream gave optimal measured performance across the rev range.

Last edited by Glyn M Ruck; 12-21-2011 at 05:08 PM.
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Old 12-21-2011, 05:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
jct - turbo cars are particularly fussy on back pressure. However going to a simple dual or quad would not have to disturb that. The only real problem is that turbo's, being exhaust driven can make an open exhaust sound like a bit of a wet fart.

Good luck! You will love the Coupe.
lol - is there anything you suggest that can avoid the wet fart sound.. i thought modifying the cat back only wouldnt affect it as i read in a previous thread? does everyone who has installed quad exhausts feel that they have lost performance?

Last edited by c250_2012; 12-21-2011 at 05:10 PM.
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Old 12-21-2011, 05:16 PM
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See my clarifying post above.

The exhaust turbine on a turbo damps the combustion noise & there is not a hell of a lot you can do about it.

Do not confuse exhaust requirements for a turbo engine with a NA engine. They are polls apart.
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Old 12-21-2011, 06:37 PM
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Originally Posted by c250_2012 View Post
lol - is there anything you suggest that can avoid the wet fart sound.. i thought modifying the cat back only wouldnt affect it as i read in a previous thread? does everyone who has installed quad exhausts feel that they have lost performance?
I also agree with Mr. Ruck. As far as trying to keep the tone still nice and pleasant to the ear, I can suggest that straight through magnaflow mufflers and resonators have worked well for me on multiple Audi 1.8t and 2.0TFSI applications. Without them it got very muddy and drone is not something most people will want on a mercedes either. I'd start with two straight through mufflers and one resonator and go from there. Try and find some folks on here who have already experimented and get soundclips while keeping in mind that the soundclips may not be representative of how it will sound to your ear when it's on your car.

cheers! mike
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Old 12-21-2011, 06:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
See my clarifying post above.

The exhaust turbine on a turbo damps the combustion noise & there is not a hell of a lot you can do about it.

Do not confuse exhaust requirements for a turbo engine with a NA engine. They are polls apart.
what do you suggest we do so that we can have the quad exhaust look (anything else apart from installing a fake one that doesnt have anything coming out of it)? surely there are ways other turbo'd cars do it.
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Old 12-21-2011, 08:25 PM
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I think a simple Y splitter like Kaewen suggests will work fine as long as there are no restrictions & you keep pipe diameters constant right through & don't mess with Benz pre turbo tuning. What it is going to sound like is another issue. Turbo cars never sound great.
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Old 12-21-2011, 08:47 PM
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This is a video of a straight up magnaflow catback system with no other mods. No removing of the resonators. No gutting of the cat or putting a race pipe on. It's on the 1.8t. Keep in mind you can get this car to sound very "farty" easily once you go up to 3" pipes and remove resonators or race pipe it. But just adding a set of magnaflows with magnaflow resonators keeps that mostly at bay.

http://youtu.be/J3TqDgGunoA

Here is what you get on the same engine when you remove the resonators and gut the cat...

http://youtu.be/EP7RGzu3vz4

Notice the difference. One sounds more muddy and one more refined.

Cheers! Mike
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Old 12-21-2011, 09:24 PM
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excellent write ups Glyn M Ruck and bhvrdr!! thanks.
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Old 12-21-2011, 10:44 PM
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theres an mtec dual pipe setup on ebay thats for single exhaust w204s, I installed a dual tip dual outlet setup similar to that one made by mtec on a c300 and it sounded great, maybe better than my meisterschaft quads. Its reasonable at about 1500ish and looks just like quad amg OEM setups. search ebay for w204 exhaust. Its a simple y pipe from the back of the stock resonator, I beleive its even bolt on you could install it with car ramps urself or if u have access to a lift
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Old 12-21-2011, 10:46 PM
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and JC get the 350, u can never have too much HP, u will end up spending $$ on an ECU and other goodies down the line. I would go 250 only if I was putting the 3k savings into motor mods, the new 350 is badass
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Old 12-22-2011, 05:19 AM
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Originally Posted by jimmythegreek View Post
theres an mtec dual pipe setup on ebay thats for single exhaust w204s, I installed a dual tip dual outlet setup similar to that one made by mtec on a c300 and it sounded great, maybe better than my meisterschaft quads. Its reasonable at about 1500ish and looks just like quad amg OEM setups. search ebay for w204 exhaust. Its a simple y pipe from the back of the stock resonator, I beleive its even bolt on you could install it with car ramps urself or if u have access to a lift
i just had a look at it http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Mercedes-...item20bbf23887

very interested, but it appears it wasnt made for the 2012 facelift. Would it be ok for the turbo?
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Old 12-22-2011, 08:14 AM
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That thing has a X pipe. Avoid that at all cost for turbo applications. From the 4 cyl you just need a Y pipe. This thing is going to get expensive quickly!!
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Old 12-22-2011, 10:51 AM
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thats the wrong one, thats for a V6, u want the single that Y pipes, its this one

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Mercedes-...item20bbf24477

I didnt install the one I posted, I installed the one u posted. I will say the finish and fit were very good and the sound is rly nice. Very deep and throaty. I have meisterschafts and from listening to sound clips it was very close to a eisenmann sound, I think their resonator u can see in the pics is like a mini muffler, so it adds tone instead of just straight pipes. I would guess the Y pipe setup will sound good, either way for 1500 and bolt on its a deal especially with that tip setup, looks really sweet to my eyes

FYI the facelift doesnt matter w exhausts, everything underneath is the same. The turbo spools pre-cat, wont affect performance, the fit is the same. All you need is to change your rear diffuser to a 2012 C63, thats all thats out as of now, OR notch you stock one, It can be done and look good if you know what your doing or have a body shop do it

Last edited by jimmythegreek; 12-22-2011 at 10:53 AM.
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Old 12-22-2011, 06:18 PM
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Originally Posted by jimmythegreek View Post
thats the wrong one, thats for a V6, u want the single that Y pipes, its this one

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Mercedes-...item20bbf24477

I didnt install the one I posted, I installed the one u posted. I will say the finish and fit were very good and the sound is rly nice. Very deep and throaty. I have meisterschafts and from listening to sound clips it was very close to a eisenmann sound, I think their resonator u can see in the pics is like a mini muffler, so it adds tone instead of just straight pipes. I would guess the Y pipe setup will sound good, either way for 1500 and bolt on its a deal especially with that tip setup, looks really sweet to my eyes

FYI the facelift doesnt matter w exhausts, everything underneath is the same. The turbo spools pre-cat, wont affect performance, the fit is the same. All you need is to change your rear diffuser to a 2012 C63, thats all thats out as of now, OR notch you stock one, It can be done and look good if you know what your doing or have a body shop do it

thanks guys.. before i order this one, are there any other brands / styles that you know of? i like this one, but preference would be to match the c63 tips a little more closer...

there have been some good write ups here on upgrading exhausts.... no doubt it will be very useful as more people receive their 2012 order and frustrated with the single exhaust look.

Last edited by c250_2012; 12-22-2011 at 06:20 PM.
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Old 12-22-2011, 06:34 PM
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You may want to look for a competent custom exhaust shop near you. You should have no problem getting two lifetime warranty high quality mufflers and a resonator as well as pipe bending and labor for about $600.

cheers! Mike
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Old 12-23-2011, 01:10 AM
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Thanks for all the feedback guys. The only reason why I am thinking about C250 is because the car will be a lease, and I can't seem to find a C350 with the equipment I want/need.

I think all I am going to do then is simply order a Y-pipe and have my exhaust guy bend some pipe to the rear, and then get 2 more y-pipes for the quad tip setup + diffuser.

This is easily the cheapest solution. Now I just need to look around for 2012 diffusers that won't cost an arm and a leg.

Last question, is the c250 muffler any different than the oem c300 muffler (size, etc)? Because if they are I would have to get a c250 muffler and re-weld the exhaust hangers (or make new ones) to make it work, unless I got aftermarket mufflers.

It seems that modifying the exhaust for sound isn't a bright future with an I4 turbo engine, so this will probably be purely cosmetic.
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Old 12-23-2011, 07:13 AM
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I have not taken a good look at the 250 muffler so I can't comment regarding it vs. the V6 mufflers. The quieter you keep the exhaust the less the turbo influences will noticed.
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Old 12-23-2011, 02:14 PM
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FYI The Mec Design and Vath are 100% the same , Kaewen also has almost the same , and there are more companies with this exhaust. I think that theres one manufactor making these for all diff brands. Think it's FOX exhaust in Germany.

Also make sure you order it for the FL because theres a diff in pipe diameter from pre FL and FL

@RB32 thats the only way it fits under a non sport pack rear. So cant help it
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