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CAR TOO BOUNCY! H&R SS Springs & 5mm pads on Stock 18" AMG Wheels & Nitto Motivo Tire

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Old 06-16-2015, 01:44 PM
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CAR TOO BOUNCY! H&R SS Springs & 5mm pads on Stock 18" AMG Wheels & Nitto Motivo Tire

 
Old 06-28-2012, 03:44 PM
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Exclamation CAR TOO BOUNCY! H&R SS Springs & 5mm pads on Stock 18" AMG Wheels & Nitto Motivo Tire

My CAR is TOO BOUNCY! Now that I have finally put on H&R Super Sports & 5mm pads on Stock 18" AMG Wheels & Nitto Motivo Tires

I am very surprised, since I went this route after searching through countless threads where many members stated that the combo was in fact riding similar to that of OEM, none having stated that the ride became bouncier, stiffer maybe but that's to be expected given the springs, this combo was also based off given statements from members that the OEM shocks are used across the many trims of the W204 all of which stock have different heights from one another.

Quoted from this thread, which is exactly how I feel as well: https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...stein-b8s.html

Am I just too sensitive, just like Knightmare69? Or is there something wrong with my install?

I didn't think I needed the performance of coil overs because I didn't think "bounce" was an issue with the H&R Super Sports, but now I am ready to trade these out and just get the H&R Street Coil Overs or maybe upgrade the shocks...

Anybody have any recommendations which is the best course of action at this point (having already installed springs but wanting to get rid of bouncy ride)?

Thanks in advance for your recommendations and comments
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Old 06-28-2012, 04:07 PM
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you could need new shocks...
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Old 06-28-2012, 04:13 PM
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Check your bump stops on top of the shocks. If they're making contact the shocks can't work correctly which can cause what your describing.

Les
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Old 06-28-2012, 04:48 PM
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Originally Posted by blue00r6 View Post
you could need new shocks...
only have 29,700 miles... and drove fine before changing springs...
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Old 06-28-2012, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Velociabstract View Post
Check your bump stops on top of the shocks. If they're making contact the shocks can't work correctly which can cause what your describing.

Les
you mean if they are NOT making contact?
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Old 06-28-2012, 05:52 PM
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No, I mean your shocks could be rendered inoperative because your basically sitting on the stops. If you only have 1/2" of travel before you hit the stopper the ride will be unusual. How much lower is the car and did you trim the bump stops?

Les
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Old 06-28-2012, 05:59 PM
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do you mean bouncy as in the car is sprung too stiffly or as in a bump causes multiple up and down bounces?

you're probably just feeling the harsher ride.
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Old 06-28-2012, 06:19 PM
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should have kept your oem rear pads...
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Old 06-28-2012, 08:33 PM
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Originally Posted by caligreenzzz View Post
should have kept your oem rear pads...
everybody recommended 5mm in the rear... I still have the old 13mm pads...

u really think that would be the difference?
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Old 06-28-2012, 08:38 PM
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Originally Posted by blue00r6 View Post
do you mean bouncy as in the car is sprung too stiffly or as in a bump causes multiple up and down bounces?

you're probably just feeling the harsher ride.
I mean, even on normal relatively flat, well paved roads or high speeds on Los Angeles freeways... the car feels noticeably more bouncy than stock to where I can feel the bounce ricochet from the front to the back over any grade change or bump...

could just be harsher ride... but the way everyone talked about the H&R SS springs made it seem to me that it was hardly noticeable from stock...
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Old 06-28-2012, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Velociabstract View Post
No, I mean your shocks could be rendered inoperative because your basically sitting on the stops. If you only have 1/2" of travel before you hit the stopper the ride will be unusual. How much lower is the car and did you trim the bump stops?

Les
Stock 2008 c350 sport suspoension with stock 18" wheels

-changed out springs only in front to H&R SS
- changed out springs in rear to H&R SS and also changed Spring pads from 13mm to 8mm

Can I check to see if the shocks are inactive without the car being on a lift?
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Old 06-29-2012, 01:02 AM
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i find mine bouncy as well, i did the install myself, made sure the bump stop was ok
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Old 06-29-2012, 07:58 AM
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I am on 19's with Super Sports, I don't find the ride bumpy however every small bump or hole makes a loud clunking sound like the spring windings are compressing onto each other. It almost sounds like something is loose.
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Old 06-29-2012, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by rb23lb View Post
I mean, even on normal relatively flat, well paved roads or high speeds on Los Angeles freeways... the car feels noticeably more bouncy than stock to where I can feel the bounce ricochet from the front to the back over any grade change or bump...

could just be harsher ride... but the way everyone talked about the H&R SS springs made it seem to me that it was hardly noticeable from stock...
Are you guys familiar with Occam's Razor? The principle suggests that the simplest explanation is usually the superior one. Modifying a car with stiffer springs and (possibly) stiffer tires, in of itself, can create the impact harshness you are experiencing. One key clue is your comment quoted here. Even without full jounce and rebound, or much deflection at all on flat highways, the impact on concrete joints, tar strips, or minor irregularities are being transmitted into the body and you are sensitive enough to find them troubling. Others may not. This is one reason I have never left 17" wheels/tires and will never drop the car for an appearance change and a possible performance/ride loss. You may want to revert to your original springs and not worry about a fractional difference in ride height. Few people carry around tape measures and who's to say if higher or lower looks better anyway? If you are trying to improve handling and steering response with minimal effect on good ride comfort, try Eibach anti-sway bars instead of lower, stiffer springs.
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Old 06-29-2012, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Sportstick View Post
who's to say if higher or lower looks better anyway?
i would say that 80%-90% of car enthusiast would say that a 4x4 look is not a good look.....
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Old 06-29-2012, 11:27 AM
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Originally Posted by caligreenzzz View Post
i would say that 80%-90% of car enthusiast would say that a 4x4 look is not a good look.....
Taking an opposite point of view to the extreme to try to discredit it is transparent and usually an unsuccessful debate tactic. My point was not in regard to SUVs. The original ride height of a C Class is well within widely accepted norms for passenger cars. True car enthusiasts don't lower cars just for appearance if it deteriorates dynamic performance, as it usually does. Style conscious status seekers are more likely to be the ones "out lowering" each other. Cheers!
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Old 06-29-2012, 11:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Sportstick View Post
Taking an opposite point of view to the extreme to try to discredit it is transparent
uhhhhhhhhhh yeah sure....
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Old 06-29-2012, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by rb23lb View Post
My CAR is TOO BOUNCY! Now that I have finally put on H&R Super Sports & 5mm pads on Stock 18" AMG Wheels & Nitto Motivo Tires

I am very surprised, since I went this route after searching through countless threads where many members stated that the combo was in fact riding similar to that of OEM, none having stated that the ride became bouncier, stiffer maybe but that's to be expected given the springs, this combo was also based off given statements from members that the OEM shocks are used across the many trims of the W204 all of which stock have different heights from one another.

Quoted from this thread, which is exactly how I feel as well: https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...stein-b8s.html
It appears that you just contradicted yourself, as that last thread about B8's that you found was someone who had a bouncier ride (and was encouraged to go with better shocks).


Originally Posted by rb23lb View Post
Am I just too sensitive, just like Knightmare69? Or is there something wrong with my install?

I didn't think I needed the performance of coil overs because I didn't think "bounce" was an issue with the H&R Super Sports, but now I am ready to trade these out and just get the H&R Street Coil Overs or maybe upgrade the shocks...

Anybody have any recommendations which is the best course of action at this point (having already installed springs but wanting to get rid of bouncy ride)?

Thanks in advance for your recommendations and comments
I think the problem is either:


1) running out of downward shock travel, or

2) riding too hard on the bump stops.


Both have been mentioned before by others, I recall. adding spacers would help both problems, sacraficing some drop but keeping the very stiff springs.

Also, check with H&R if they have a suggested method of shortening (cutting) the bump cushions. They may be mounted on the body, or on top of the struts. Before you dropped it, there was a gap to these rubber, cylindrical cushions during normal ride. But if you rode over a dip or mild pothole, these cushions had a soft initial spring rate to work with the springs (in parallel) to absorb the bump.

Anyone have a pic of the actual H&R SS spring set on the floor (not a cataloge shot) ?

.
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Old 06-29-2012, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Sportstick View Post
..... True car enthusiasts don't lower cars just for appearance if it deteriorates dynamic performance, as it usually does. Style conscious status seekers are more likely to be the ones "out lowering" each other. Cheers!
Harsh Sportstick

I've accepted that for some enthusiasts, lowering for appearance IS their thing, and not everyone has to appreciate their cars the way you and I do.

As an a hole that caused death and billions of dollars of damage once said:

"can't we all ... just ... get along ... can't we" as he was ready to pocket millions of dollars for his mischief.

.
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Old 06-29-2012, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted by kevink2 View Post
I think the problem is either:


1) running out of downward shock travel, or

2) riding too hard on the bump stops.
Why do you diagnose this if he is complaining about ride harshness on relatively consistent surfaces (highways) without anything close to full jounce/rebound? Don't we need a root cause consistent with minimal suspension deflection? I think it seems more likely spring rate and tire sidewall stiffness are primary suspects.
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Old 06-29-2012, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Sportstick View Post
Are you guys familiar with Occam's Razor? The principle suggests that the simplest explanation is usually the superior one. Modifying a car with stiffer springs and (possibly) stiffer tires, in of itself, can create the impact harshness you are experiencing. One key clue is your comment quoted here. Even without full jounce and rebound, or much deflection at all on flat highways, the impact on concrete joints, tar strips, or minor irregularities are being transmitted into the body and you are sensitive enough to find them troubling. Others may not. This is one reason I have never left 17" wheels/tires and will never drop the car for an appearance change and a possible performance/ride loss. You may want to revert to your original springs and not worry about a fractional difference in ride height. Few people carry around tape measures and who's to say if higher or lower looks better anyway? If you are trying to improve handling and steering response with minimal effect on good ride comfort, try Eibach anti-sway bars instead of lower, stiffer springs.
+1
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Old 06-29-2012, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by kevink2 View Post
Harsh Sportstick

I've accepted that for some enthusiasts, lowering for appearance IS their thing, and not everyone has to appreciate their cars the way you and I do.

As an a hole that caused death and billions of dollars of damage once said:

"can't we all ... just ... get along ... can't we" as he was ready to pocket millions of dollars for his mischief.

.
My apologies if I hit "harsh"...I was aiming for "blunt" in response to the contribution about 4x4s during what had been a productive dialogue. The point remains that there are different segments within the "car-involved" population, and it may be overly nuanced, but if one is willing to give up dynamic performance for appearance, they are not "true car enthusiasts" (my earlier term) but "car design enthusiasts".
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Old 06-29-2012, 05:02 PM
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Originally Posted by kevink2 View Post

I think the problem is either:


1) running out of downward shock travel, or

How do I run out of downward shock travel if I am doing what others did and using SS on stock shocks? Do you mean that the installation was botched and this is not normal?

2) riding too hard on the bump stops.

How do I not "ride hard"? Do you mean put back the 13mm instead of the 8mm?

Both have been mentioned before by others, I recall. adding spacers would help both problems, sacraficing some drop but keeping the very stiff springs.

How do "spacers" sacrafice drop? Don't spacers just widen the wheel base? I was thinking about adding 5mm spacers to the rear just so they sit more flush...


Also, check with H&R if they have a suggested method of shortening (cutting) the bump cushions. They may be mounted on the body, or on top of the struts. Before you dropped it, there was a gap to these rubber, cylindrical cushions during normal ride. But if you rode over a dip or mild pothole, these cushions had a soft initial spring rate to work with the springs (in parallel) to absorb the bump.

I watched my friend put the new REAR H&R spring right back into the new bump stop 5mm cushion, right where the old one was... What do you mean, before it was dropped, there was a "gap"???


Anyone have a pic of the actual H&R SS spring set on the floor (not a cataloge shot) ?

.
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Old 06-29-2012, 05:05 PM
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Originally Posted by angeloxnet View Post
i find mine bouncy as well, i did the install myself, made sure the bump stop was ok
i think the bottom line here is that those that said H&R super sport "ride like stock" in many of the other previous threads, are not as sensitive or pay as much attention to detail as you or I or Knightmare69

Just another example how even with extensive research, you can not always rely on other opinions, because they are just that, opinions and in the end everybody will react differently to the feel of a new suspension setup....
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Old 06-29-2012, 05:11 PM
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I have the same problem with my SS springs. Frankly, it rides like complete sh*t. I'm considering coil-overs but not sure I want to drop that much cash on this car. I'm already kicking myself for not getting the C350. DAMN those fleeting moments of practicality!!

It takes corners well with the SS springs but that's about it. Now that my springs have settled a bit, it looks too low in my opinion. A little on the ghetto side...kinda like those kids with the Honda Civics sitting on bump stops and the wheels tucked half way into the wheel well. Originally, I purchased the Sport springs, not the Super Sports...in retrospect, I should have gone with my gut and kept the Sports or gone with Eibachs.
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