paulGT3

Speaking of turning heads. I have had more people just come up to me out of the blue with this car than ever did with my 2 GT3's. Dont know if its because its (AMG) that good looking or people were intimidated by the Porsche. I find it weird.
I would have thought other wise.

BTW Per capita income is really my town Ridgecrest Ca. We have 20,000 people of whom 2/3rds are Scientist Engineers and the rest school teachers. Because is a Naval town (in the middle of the desert) without much Naval personnel (Enlisted) we dont have many people here who earn lower incomes. Thus you have households like me an engineer married to a computer scientist, that are high double incomes without many poverty level people. Not that great of a town We have a hard time recruiting people out here to the HEAT. Someone figured this out in a BRAC call for base closure study so take that for what its worth.
But we don't qualify because our city size is too small. Same goes for per capita education levels. Lots of Phd Physicists and MSEEs, but not many Taco Bell workers NOT That I am picking on Taco Bell workers mind you. I love that Volcano taco!!
But just an odd fact. We are a VERY odd size town in the middle of nowhere
with all kinds of oddities in population just because of the Military Center here. Youd be hard pressed to find another California town so far from any other towns out side of San Bernadino county.
Odd facts that dont mean crap!

Quicktwinturbo

When did C63 forum turned in to a battle zone?? Damn fellas~ chill...

impr

Heh quicktwinturbo I'm pretty chill right here Just having some forum fun.

edit mistyped your name :P

Whats your twin turbo ride anyway? fd rx7?

Quicktwinturbo

I had TT FD3S n Supra TT (switched to single) while ago

impr

Nice nice :p

I always wanted to tune up my 02 GDA wrx but in the end decided against it. Had it all planned out 6 years ago when I first bought it. First it was gonna be a vf22 turbo/vishnu stg 2 tune, then a few years later I wanted a vf39.. At one point there was a complete S-202 drivetrain available in the buy/sell forums too. O well .

kip

So according to Nissan only their engineers can drive the cars like that? Its funny how I have never heard that a guarantee is void in a toyota yaris, because someone launched it as hard as he could.

I hate companies that make a product you cannot use. And if the product brakes after you use it like they market it, they blame you.

This somehow reminds me of a certain Volvo S60R, which was made to be a competitor to the M3, but then they made it so safe and heavy that it barely could match its cheaper sibling the S60 T5.

200onthedash

As long as you don't use the LC, which is in the agreement you sign, you are covered by your warranty. The guy said he used the LC 20 times, which is probably more like 50, would you clutch drop any MT 50 times? Especially a brand new car. Everyone that has bought a GT-R knows not to turn off the VDC, otherwise you are gambling. The GT-R is a track car, the GT-R is not meant to drag race or do stop light races. As for the folks who have a 2009, these will be the cool one's to own, because it is obvious Nissan will disable this "secret feature". The Ferrari 599 has a LC that Ferrari does not recognize.

Bottom line, you clutch drop any car over and over, it will break. Put a C63 in N, build the revs to 4500 and the shift it into D. Repeat 50 times, and see what happens. People that bought the GT-R for what it is, a track monster, consider the LC to be a bit of a gimmick. 0-60 in 3.9 with out LC is pretty quick.

If LC is a "deal breaker", you not looking at the right car. The GT-R is meant to be driven in all R mode.

rcalcaide

Well said. Its been a long time since Ive posted on mbworld. I previously had a C32 AMG, then a 996 Turbo. Now for the past month I have a GT-R. I absolutely love it!!! IT IS a supercar. Everything on this car is well executed. Yes, the car has launch control. I have yet to try it. Im sure I will. But will I use LC 20 times in a one to two month span? HELL NO!!! Of course Nissan will void the warranty. That is utter ABUSE, not high performance driving! You are intentionally trying to destroy the car. What car manufacturer would honor a warranty on that kind of driving? IF I dumped the clutch on my Porsche constantly, then asked them to fix it, Im sure the warranty would be voided as well.

Quicktwinturbo

I'm pretty sure porsche can take 20 hard launches.. in a week.
Come on.. They put LC in the car so the buyers can ACTUALLY USE IT. If that causes problem, why is it on the car? Doesn't make any sense to me.

HLG600

It doesn't get much simpler than that. Nissan knows very well that the majority of their target market will use the performance on the street, not the track, and that lateral G's in day to day driving don't matter nearly as much as a stoplight performance. LC is designed to minimize abuse when extracting that real-world performance, so the 4500 rpm neutral drop in an automatic car is an irrelevant comparison. The fact is, is that Nissan incorporated a LC that turns off VDC, which in effect, voids the warranty. This is their design from the factory, and not an aftermarket tweak. If the case was the latter, I would have far less sympathy. I addressed this in the thread in OT as well. Either integrate a LC that doesn't turn off VDC, or don't void the warranty on the matter.

200onthedash

The LC has never been recognized by Nissan. They do not cover it. The VDC is for getting out of the snow, if stuck.

The car can do 0-60 in 3.3 with LC and 3.8 without. You gain .5 a second. Which is only useful in a drag race. I don't feel the need to "street race", so that is not an issue for me.

If this seems like a deal breaker, then the GTR wasnt the right car for you anyway. Not that difficult to understand. I plan on getting one, as soon as the hype wears off, and people start feeling the economy.

Something the GTR can do that no other car can. When I find said GTR, I can take it to the dealer, and get the memory scanned to find out exactly how the car was driven.

Once again, the GTR is a track car, not a dragster.

impr

rcalcaide the difference is in a porsche if you kept dumping the clutch you'd have to simply replace the clutch usually. With the GTR's launch control you have to replace the entire 20,000 transmission. I'm sure the GTR can outhandle anything MB currently makes but the black box paired with their incredibly tight warranty makes it difficult for someone looking to enjoy their car while using it for its intended purpose.

Additionally in some other manufacturer's vehicles LC actually is safer to use than a manual launch. The Porsche 911 Turbo comes to mind where its computer regulated launch is actually less rough on the car. In the GTR's case however their LC seems to attempt to get the fastest launch no matter what.

The GTR's performance figures as tested in magazines don't lie which make it an amazing vehicle, but if it truly is as fragile as some customers are realizing it could be a costly endeavor if you enjoy obtaining it. In my opinion Nissan shouldn't have allowed VDC to be turned off at all if they knew it would result in such catastrophic results eventually for its owners. As you said yourselves LC is more of a gimmick and if so, why bother including it? I'm sure it would be a much more clear cut case if Nissan read off the black box and saw that some has done repeated torque brake launches. It seems, to me at least that Nissan is heavily subsidizing the GTR's cost so they can provide to the customer base for significantly cheaper than the R&D costs, but at the same time they're looking to make back whatever money they can by utilizing incredibly strict warranty policies. Nothing wrong with this, but not exactly an enjoyable proposition for some car enthusiasts.

exiges

I've driven the new GT-R hard around the Nurburgring circuit (as well as on road) and it really does live up to all the hype.. for the money nothing can touch it (and not much twice the price either).

All this nonsense about the launch is pointless, I mean who with any mechanical sympathy would use a launch system anyway ?

Nissan should just remove the feature and it'd become a non-issue overnight.

I can't wait to have one next year.. until then my C63 will have to make-do.

gravedgr

I would trust Porsche's test.

http://carsguide.news.com.au/site/mo...e_cheat_claim/

MRAMG1

I have to DISAGREE with this post, because after Saturday at Beaverun, there was a GTR using launch control with NO PROBLEMS. Furthermore I read his manual, and NO WHERE DID it state that the use of launch control would damage or denie the warrenty. The only thing it did say, in section 5-42, I think, was that on slippery roads it could cause the engine to rev without vehicle movement.

Anyway, the car was VERY impressive on the track, and as I said, after reading this post on Friday, I had to read the guys manual. He never heard of this BS either, and I can assure you, when he took me for a ride that his Launch control was ACTIVE

Nice car, but kinda looks like a batmobile, IMHO

See yeah

impr

Wow the weather sure is illiterate today. Must be nice to have 6.999 million other people to keep you company . You might need to drink a few more redbulls if you want to get through my post without flipping on MTV's top pop group. Its one thing to disagree with an opinion except for the part where my post about Nissan denying the warranty on septskylines GTR b/c he turned off VDC and used launch control is fact. You can say you disagree that this practice isn't very auto enthusiast friendly, or you disagree and think the GTR is awesome despite its issues with the transmission. But you can't DISAGREE that nissan refused to replace a transmission under warranty and stuck the guy with a 20,000 bill because he used launch control 20 times.

If you read my post and decided to further click the link to read the guy who had his warranty denied by Nissan. Nissan you know the ones that made the car and make the warranty agreements? All the Nissan GTR fanboys and owners clearly stated that Nissan told them that VDC could only be off to get out of harsh weather conditions. As such the utilization of Launch Control is not covered by Nissan's transmission warranty.

In short

-Guy buys GTR signs a waiver that agrees to VDC being off. Entire GTR community which supports the GTR backs this up and is their only defense against the Launch Control fiasco.

-Guy launched the car 20 times
-Transmission died.
-Nissan downloaded black box data
-NISSAN denied him warranty on the basis of launch control.
-guy is upset complains
-gtr community uses their one solid foot to stand on which is:
NISSAN told them do not turn off the VDC unless you're stuck in dirt or snow.
-Automotive enthusiast is upset as this is perfectly legal but highly devious behavior including a LC that can effectively stick you with a 20,000 bill.

That doesn't mean the car can't use launch control. It just means there's a much greater chance of the car breaking while using launch control. And good to know you read the manual where it doesn't say anything about that. You should tell Nissan then they can honor the guy's warranty! I guess it was all just a big misunderstanding. (i know sarcasm is hard to read through typing).


Really did you even bother reading through oh say like even 2 pages of the source post? Don't forget to vote!

See "yeah" too.

passcheco

Quicktwinturbo

Theyare impressive... But are they reliable? One usage of LC mite be ok.. But few more can leave you with $20,000 bill for your "brand new" ride..
To sum everything up, It's in the manual that if you turn off the VDC, that will void your warrenty. LC turns off the VDC.. Therefore, kiss your warrenty good byeeeee if you use the LC..

Is it worth it? I guess it is for someone who can afford it.. Would you take the risk? I wouldn't...

MRAMG1

Grow up newbie. I have been around tracks, and lovely individuals such as yourself far too long to worry about it.

I was simply reporting on a GTR's performance, which was good.
I read the manual, after reading some of your posts, for my own behalf. Again, [B]NO WHERE IN IT DID IT STATE IT WOULD VOID YOUR WARRENTY[B]

ps: Do you own one

See yeah

PS: I'll wager you are a Democrat

impr

Wow... really? reallly? You really haven't read this thread at all or the source thread at all have you. Look like someone needs to grow up and finally get into highschool reading comprehension.

First good for you achieving vet status on this forum. Yet part of another elite group of intellectual "titans". Secondly worry about it? What is it? Thirdly, read my post or any of the posts again in fact do a search. I've ridden in GTRs and their monstrous performance is obvious to anyone. If you READ the post and READ the source thread the company which made the GTR also known as NISSAN is refusing to honor the warranty on the basis that the owner of the busted GTR turned off VDC and used Launch Control.

Read QuickTwinTurbo's post. Read the ENTIRE Nagtroc thread. Look at the screenshots. Protip: Bolding what you've found while blindfolded with your fingers in your ears doesn't equate to factual information.

edit: just saw your post

So let me get this straight. You didn't bother to read the entire post and just decided to rush in a post up some random junk because you have the attention span of a 4 year old on qualudes. Good on you! What did you say that had me dreaming that up? Hmmm I dunno maybe your inability to READ and collect information before making an informed post? Also why would anyone sign it? I don't know but they did. Because NISSAN made them sign it if they took ownership of the car. I'm seriously amazed at the ability of safety standards and regulations in our world that allow your continued survival. Round of applause for the govt. here. (that's sarcasm again).

edit2: on the topic of my political alignment again READING something for longer than 10 seconds might actually help you write something that doesn't make you seem like a complete imbecile.

splinter

Per Nissan:

“…Your Warranty Information Booklet describes a number of express limitations and exclusions for failure to follow the instructions contained in this Operator’s Manual including…driving with the VDC off…”

From June...www.mygtr.com/forum/showthread.php?t=245

beemaze

That should clarify things...

paulGT3

The Truth is Nissan tried to make a car super car (super UGLY car) and they tried to make it come in at the $70K USD mark. They failed. They have already raised the price to $80K USD and according to the Nissan Forum right now suspended production(Dont know how true that it) Supposedly you cant order one right now. Guys NOT using LC are finding tranny failures and having Nissan come back and voiding the warranty and requesting $20K for repair.
They got caught cheating on the Ring. There is evidence that the mules that came over for mag tests were not production models but the R-SPec version to come out later. So Nissan is finding out making a car that rivals the Porsche 911 Twin Turbo (their stated target) is harder than they thought. Its hard to make a car with 500hp out of a 3.6 liter thats reliable, that can be driven to the track (obviously the Nissan CANT be yet) driven hard at the track with all the worlds other supercars and then driven home. Thats something even Ferrari and Lamborghini hasnt accomplished without spotty results. Right now Nissan is flying technicians to the US repeatedly (according to the Nissan forums) to figure out what the heck these Americans are doing to their cars that they didnt count on in their labs. I think the car was released before Nissan wanted too. They are doing what American manufacturers get caught doing. Using their customers as the quality and control

impr

Mmm well to be fair. While I absolutely despise what Nissan did with their whole Warranty voiding LC. They did it legally. Also from what I've read those who haven't used the LC haven't experienced any issues with their transmission.

Also the whole cheating thing on the ring right now is just the word of one manufacturer against another. Nissan has fielded their result and until there is a fully documented neutral test that involves both parties to put both claims to rest.

Furthermore, there is no such thing as an R-spec I believe you mean V-spec. As for magazines documenting it actually being that version, I have yet to read a magazine that claims this. Motor Trend dyno tested and weighed the GTR's and their only findings were that the GTR's produce more HP than claimed by the manufacturer. When owner's have dyno'd their production cars they are finding similar results. In addition, when they weighed the car it was not lighter that what the spec sheet said.

The V-spec GTR is intended to be about 250kgs lighter at least, and have approx 50 more hp. Also it is rumored to have a much stronger transmission. While Nissan definately dropped the ball on the whole GTR transmission warranty issue, one would be remiss to downplay all the other 3rd party data that has been collected on the car which shows that it can in fact live up to its reported performance. It's just got some serious issues with its transmission when used in a LC setting.

paulGT3

Youre right I had the Specs wrong!!LOL

the suspicion I have seen was on some auto blogs not in any of the mags.
But in the beginning the cars were hotter than the later versions coming into the USA. Some mags were startling slower than the test mules they first got their hands on.

I agree with you on the tranny. I think Nissan tried, they just had to cut corners, and had to rely on their customers for Q & A. They are not the first manufacturer to have to do that.