Performance Development for M156
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 284
Likes: 103
C63
Performance Development for M156
So the M156 is what, 11yrs old now and the performance market is well established.
Most of us run out until headers/tune and stop. That's no bad thing, but supercharging aside which is a big step in $ (and performance) I haven't seen of any new developments for the engine. Is there anything going on or is it as far as it can go for reasonable R&D costs and subsequent, non-irrational pricing for consumers?
The biggest ones I've picked up on, but haven't materialised are:
- twin turbo setup
- air intake (another alternative to ROW)
- Cams
Most of us run out until headers/tune and stop. That's no bad thing, but supercharging aside which is a big step in $ (and performance) I haven't seen of any new developments for the engine. Is there anything going on or is it as far as it can go for reasonable R&D costs and subsequent, non-irrational pricing for consumers?
The biggest ones I've picked up on, but haven't materialised are:
- twin turbo setup
- air intake (another alternative to ROW)
- Cams
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 8,080
Likes: 2,868
From: Los Angeles
2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
SLS intake
Cams
Bigger throttle bodies
Port and polish heads
After that you have to dig into the engine if you want much more NA power, or slap on a supercharger or turbos. There's not much else - it's a pretty basic formula for most NA cars. What do you think is missing?
Cams
Bigger throttle bodies
Port and polish heads
After that you have to dig into the engine if you want much more NA power, or slap on a supercharger or turbos. There's not much else - it's a pretty basic formula for most NA cars. What do you think is missing?
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 284
Likes: 103
C63
I don't think anything is missing, more so wondering where all the dev went. It's just genuine interest in what may or may not be coming, or if there is nothing. Personally I'd like to continue past headers but not as far as supercharging.
Over here, we had one car that was in Eurocharged HQ for a new, sparkly and all singing Cam upgrade, and then like all other dev went totally silent. Then EC folded as a business in the UK so that was that.
Last heard on the EC twin turbo front was that the 800whp upgrade was too radical of an upgrade for a consumer kit, so they were looking late 2017 to develop a 700whp kit with 650 injectors on a customer car. Again, silence since.
Where are the mainstream suppliers of Cams and bigger TB's, and where are all the cars running them, the charts etc? There's no chat on the forums and no-one piping up about the modifications. I'm just interested to learn a little more about the options, what is realistically the limit of the engine, N/A without E85 (not available here), Meth or N20 and who reputably can supply/support the parts.
Things like p&p are obviously not OTS but, I don't see many people running an SLS intake or reported, measurable gains vs C63 ROW.
Is the easisest option after headers just to call Weistec or Magnuson?
Over here, we had one car that was in Eurocharged HQ for a new, sparkly and all singing Cam upgrade, and then like all other dev went totally silent. Then EC folded as a business in the UK so that was that.
Last heard on the EC twin turbo front was that the 800whp upgrade was too radical of an upgrade for a consumer kit, so they were looking late 2017 to develop a 700whp kit with 650 injectors on a customer car. Again, silence since.
Where are the mainstream suppliers of Cams and bigger TB's, and where are all the cars running them, the charts etc? There's no chat on the forums and no-one piping up about the modifications. I'm just interested to learn a little more about the options, what is realistically the limit of the engine, N/A without E85 (not available here), Meth or N20 and who reputably can supply/support the parts.
Things like p&p are obviously not OTS but, I don't see many people running an SLS intake or reported, measurable gains vs C63 ROW.
Is the easisest option after headers just to call Weistec or Magnuson?
Last edited by Cozy; Jun 25, 2017 at 11:36 AM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,219
Likes: 147
2012 c63 AMG, 2011 GLK 350, 2019 GLS 450
Is the easisest option after headers just to call Weistec or Magnuson?[/QUOTE]
yes why wouldn't you? Best bang for buck. Unless you just want something different I guess
yes why wouldn't you? Best bang for buck. Unless you just want something different I guess
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 8,080
Likes: 2,868
From: Los Angeles
2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
Where "all the dev went"? What else is there to develop exactly? And what percentage of Benz buyers modify their cars - 1%? No wonder there's no aftermarket.
Thread Starter
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 284
Likes: 103
C63
I'm not asking anyone to develop anything, only what happened to the existing projects that I outlined. I think you'll find that a majority of M156 owners enjoy to modify, as you do clearly having participated also, so you surely understand. I asked you some questions, but like most treads, you pick one point and push on that, ignoring the thread purpose and riding off on a tangeant.
What you should have written is, "I don't know", or perhaps not have written at all. Anyway, if anyone has any input or would care to share their experience with Cams, p&p or other I'd be interested to read. There was a thread about a new intake but, I can't find any more info.
If there literally is nothing for reasonable money between headers and SC, then I suppose that would explain the perpetual threads on ROWs, headers, EC vs OE etc.
Last edited by Cozy; Jun 25, 2017 at 12:11 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 8,080
Likes: 2,868
From: Los Angeles
2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
EC may have squeezed some more hp from the variable intake side of their tune, so there is still some dev going on. And on the chassis and transmission side, there is still a lot of untapped potential for most to uncover.
Trending Topics
Super Member
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 704
Likes: 81
From: Destin FL
2018 E63 AMG S
SLS intake
Cams
Bigger throttle bodies
Port and polish heads
After that you have to dig into the engine if you want much more NA power, or slap on a supercharger or turbos. There's not much else - it's a pretty basic formula for most NA cars. What do you think is missing?
Cams
Bigger throttle bodies
Port and polish heads
After that you have to dig into the engine if you want much more NA power, or slap on a supercharger or turbos. There's not much else - it's a pretty basic formula for most NA cars. What do you think is missing?
MB World Stories
The Best of Mercedes & AMG
7 Craziest Things AMG Gas Ever Built
Verdad Gallardo
New Electric Mercedes-AMG GT 4-Door Coupe Unveiled: 10 Things You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
6 Mercedes Models That Did NOT Age Well (But Are Somehow Still Cool)
Verdad Gallardo
Manual Mercedes? 6 Times Sindelfingen Let Drivers Have All The Fun
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Verdad Gallardo
8 Classic Boxy Mercedes Designs That Have Aged Like Fine Wine
Verdad Gallardo
Flawlessly Restored Mercedes 190E Evo II Heads to Auction
Verdad Gallardo
Electric Mercedes C-Class Unveiled: 11 Things You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes EQS Gets A Major Update: Everything You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
Senior Member
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 482
Likes: 125
From: Las Vegas, NV
2014 C63 Coupe
I disagree. This forum represent a minuscule percentage of owners overall, and an even smaller percentage of that membership is going to mod their cars beyond something cosmetic. That being said, the market is very small and personally, having been in the business of making and selling aftermarket parts, I'm not sure the return would be worth it to develop something to compete with existing solutions.
Super Member
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 941
Likes: 74
From: Orlando FL
a unicorn tuned p30 e63
there is a recent unicorn tune (custom tune by eurocharged) it worked wonders on my car a few others. just like the others are saying, there are alternatives but the dollar for HP doesn't make sense.
Former Vendor of MBWorld
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 541
Likes: 130
From: Georgetown, TX
93' 500E, 95' Corolla
Run E85!
It's the BEST!
Make more power for less, and close the gap between you and the Stg1 Weistec guys easily. If you ever do go S/C, you'll be glad you're running E since it handles boost way better than gas
Thanks
Dave
It's the BEST!
Make more power for less, and close the gap between you and the Stg1 Weistec guys easily. If you ever do go S/C, you'll be glad you're running E since it handles boost way better than gas
Thanks
Dave
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 2,899
Likes: 93
C63 AMG
I think it starts - and probably has ended with - the difficulty in making more aggressive camshaft profiles work in the M156. I'm not aware of a single instance on this forum of successful integration of aftermarket cams with the factory variable cam timing map programmed into the ECU. Has there been even one? And w/o cams, P&P, larger throttle bodies and the like just won't deliver the gains to make them worthwhile. IIRC factory camshafts adjust overlap and timing over a range of 42º. Good luck with tuning that in the aftermarket.
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 253
Likes: 34
From: San Diego, CA
2015 G63, Sold 2010 C63 AMG Development Package
Unicorn tune?!?! I want that just for the name alone!
Dave, is there any active hardware/software to give an indication of what percentage of ethanol is the gas mixture that you know any of the kit cars are using?
Dave, is there any active hardware/software to give an indication of what percentage of ethanol is the gas mixture that you know any of the kit cars are using?
Junior Member
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 22
Likes: 4
From: Tampa Bay, FL
C63 AMG
This. With the popularity of TT vs SC I'm really surprised not more info is available, or that more companies aren't working on this. Personally I'd like to see a streetable TT kit for these cars. They have huge potential for big power.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 1,175
Likes: 130
From: NY
2010 C63 2019 GLA45
SLS intake
Cams
Bigger throttle bodies
Port and polish heads
After that you have to dig into the engine if you want much more NA power, or slap on a supercharger or turbos. There's not much else - it's a pretty basic formula for most NA cars. What do you think is missing?
Cams
Bigger throttle bodies
Port and polish heads
After that you have to dig into the engine if you want much more NA power, or slap on a supercharger or turbos. There's not much else - it's a pretty basic formula for most NA cars. What do you think is missing?
When you mention the SLS intake, that's just a general answer regarding the M156, or do you know of people that fit that to the C63 AMG? I thought it doesn't fit.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 8,080
Likes: 2,868
From: Los Angeles
2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
Super Member
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 825
Likes: 114
From: Eufaula, Al/Georgetown, GA
W213 E63S Wagon, W204 C63 P30(RIP), WK1 Grand Cherokee SRT8(RIP)
I too have seen the SLS intake on a w204, several here and one in person in Las Vegas (I believe that car was done by Galpin but there was no one around to ask any questions to, it was on display) Hell, there was another w204 with an SL65 V12 sitting right beside it....I'm sure both ran well,well,well over $100k with mods quite easily so cost makes it a no go for 99% of us 1%ers
...and the twin turbo w204 exists as well. Video is out there and it is a BRUTE, but again cost to develop,package and integrate is beyond astronomical.
....I am not the guru of M156 performance enhancement as others on this forum are, but I will say that this forum has initiated, tested and reported about every conceivable iteration of what each performance mod does and the membership here is longstanding enough to where when something "new" is brought up someone always chimes in with a "nope, so-and-so tried that a few years back, here is a link to the thread."....I honestly believe that the combination of 10 full years of trying to pull every ounce of umph from the 6.2 along with the fact that MB really did pull all the stops and gave us a powerplant damn near factory polished to the max right out of the box means that pretty much all roads have been travelled for the w204 C63 lineup.
...and the twin turbo w204 exists as well. Video is out there and it is a BRUTE, but again cost to develop,package and integrate is beyond astronomical.
....I am not the guru of M156 performance enhancement as others on this forum are, but I will say that this forum has initiated, tested and reported about every conceivable iteration of what each performance mod does and the membership here is longstanding enough to where when something "new" is brought up someone always chimes in with a "nope, so-and-so tried that a few years back, here is a link to the thread."....I honestly believe that the combination of 10 full years of trying to pull every ounce of umph from the 6.2 along with the fact that MB really did pull all the stops and gave us a powerplant damn near factory polished to the max right out of the box means that pretty much all roads have been travelled for the w204 C63 lineup.
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 853
Likes: 126
From: Cape Town
2014 Mercedes C63 AMG 507 Edition
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 853
Likes: 126
From: Cape Town
2014 Mercedes C63 AMG 507 Edition
Junior Member
Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 18
Likes: 18
2007 E63 AMG
So the M156 is what, 11yrs old now and the performance market is well established.
Most of us run out until headers/tune and stop. That's no bad thing, but supercharging aside which is a big step in $ (and performance) I haven't seen of any new developments for the engine. Is there anything going on or is it as far as it can go for reasonable R&D costs and subsequent, non-irrational pricing for consumers?
The biggest ones I've picked up on, but haven't materialised are:
- twin turbo setup
- air intake (another alternative to ROW)
- Cams
Most of us run out until headers/tune and stop. That's no bad thing, but supercharging aside which is a big step in $ (and performance) I haven't seen of any new developments for the engine. Is there anything going on or is it as far as it can go for reasonable R&D costs and subsequent, non-irrational pricing for consumers?
The biggest ones I've picked up on, but haven't materialised are:
- twin turbo setup
- air intake (another alternative to ROW)
- Cams
M156 twin gt3076 2 water to air and 1 air to air intercoolers. 7 psi no problem
