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Nevermind, already got told no by your sales staff. I've never heard of a company not being able to ship to a specific stae before. What you do to your car should be on you, not the company. Every other manufacturer ships to CA. I wish I didnt wait for this intake for months only to have to buy a different one anyway
I wish that was the case, but it's actually illegal for sale in CA. You can imagine how many walk-ins we get just to disappoint the customers
CARB and EPA enforce this heavily and we abide by the laws.
Tell that to the Famous Shelby aftermarket for Mustang, Weistec ...etc You can have both with bigger pipes, filters and enclosure box for cool air. Since I’m running higher boost with stock intercooler that might already be max out. I don’t think it can keep the air temp down with an open air box that pretty much suck in 20-30 degree increased in hotter air. I really though it going to look like this ...,
temps don’t matter on turbo cars nearly as much as flow. There’s a reason why most serious hp cars just run screens over the inlet.
that pictured kit is extremely restrictive. Basically still relying on the crappy OEM corrugated junction. It’s a flow bottleneck.
Last edited by ezatnova; Sep 24, 2019 at 06:22 PM.
temps don’t matter on turbo cars nearly as much as flow. There’s a reason why most serious hp cars just run screens over the inlet..
There is a limit to this. You'll see that serious horsepower cars run turbos with just screens over the inlet, but in a location that is NOT in an enclosed space and NOT right over the engine. There is a point where flow becomes counterproductive if temps are too high.
I see the BMS one is up. Seems like a steep price bump for minimally more material than the c43 design. I get it, up Market car, r&d, blah blah blah.
Fewer potential unit sales to divide over similar development and manufacturing costs. So the price has to be higher. Just how it goes on lower volume cars. We sell our BMW N54 intake for $95 in part because we're able to sell 250 of them a month. It's also much simpler.
We've done a lot of 1/2 mile testing with our C63 intake and it won't disappoint. No heat soak issues with the included shielding even doing back to back to back runs. Sounds awesome. Looks awesome. Retains the factory filter sensors. We hope you guys really like it.
There is a limit to this. You'll see that serious horsepower cars run turbos with just screens over the inlet, but in a location that is NOT in an enclosed space and NOT right over the engine. There is a point where flow becomes counterproductive if temps are too high.
What you want is the highest volume (lowest pressure drop) with the coldest air. What Payam was trying to explain is that when you seal up the airbox and add extra ducting you create extra restriction. The restriction does more harm than the nominal intake temperature rise due to fact that the air is going to be super heated and cooled post intake. We studied a few models on the C63 and found retaining the factory air openings with small shields to block radiant heat and bias the intake air provided the best all around compromise given the packaging restraints. Of course, if you guys were open to cutting huge holes in the hood that would change the dynamic a little but not as much as you'd think.
I don't get it...a vendor finally comes out with an intake that isn't priced into the stratosphere, is a nice functional design backed by dyno results and testing, and people still ***** and moan. The prototype pictures have been up for months, so the design shouldn't be a surprise. If you like the sealed ones, go get one of them, or alternatively, get those overpriced airbox spacers
I don't get it...a vendor finally comes out with an intake that isn't priced into the stratosphere, is a nice functional design backed by dyno results and testing, and people still ***** and moan. The prototype pictures have been up for months, so the design shouldn't be a surprise. If you like the sealed ones, go get one of them, or alternatively, get those overpriced airbox spacers
That's social media for you. We're happy with the design and its performance over the last few months and several 1/2 mile airport races with our C63 and we're confident customers will really like this intake too. But like any modification it's not going to be for everyone.
So in another words, all those sealed air box like Weistec ... etc. not a good designed. Man, I would love to have Weistec debate on this.
We have a friendly relationship with Weistec and work together on projects from time to time so we're certainly not going to suggest their intake is bad or that ours is better. They are clearly different designs and frankly probably appeal to different segments of the community.
I don't get it...a vendor finally comes out with an intake that isn't priced into the stratosphere, is a nice functional design backed by dyno results and testing, and people still ***** and moan. The prototype pictures have been up for months, so the design shouldn't be a surprise. If you like the sealed ones, go get one of them, or alternatively, get those overpriced airbox spacers
From a business point, should offer both? If both as the same price, the enclosure airbox would definitely out sell the other. What is the #1 thing people complaining about the other design? Price !!!
Btw, what dyno result?
I don't get it...a vendor finally comes out with an intake that isn't priced into the stratosphere, is a nice functional design backed by dyno results and testing, and people still ***** and moan. The prototype pictures have been up for months, so the design shouldn't be a surprise. If you like the sealed ones, go get one of them, or alternatively, get those overpriced airbox spacers
From a business point, should offer both? If both as the same price, the enclosure airbox would definitely out sell the other. What is the #1 thing people complaining about the other design? Price !!!
Btw, what dyno result?
Please explain why AMG has compromised on their air intake system? According to these blogs they haven't learned the principles of basic air intake flow for maximum HP. I agree the stock air filter can be improved for flow, K&N and BMC, past that conversion there's not much to do unless the motor is radically tuned.
Please explain why AMG has compromised on their air intake system? According to these blogs they haven't learned the principles of basic air intake flow for maximum HP. I agree the stock air filter can be improved for flow, K&N and BMC, past that conversion there's not much to do unless the motor is radically tuned.
That's the question right? Why does every OEM turbo engine in the market pull in cold air? I think it's because that's honestly the best, but I get what BMS is saying that when you want to increase horsepower past factory levels, you might have to sacrifice some thermal dynamics for pure flow. If the car came from the factory with 800hp, they probably would have redesigned the entire engine bay for a larger cold air intake, but because of the current setup, the best we can do is sacrifice some temperature for flow.
Originally Posted by chongl
I don't get it...a vendor finally comes out with an intake that isn't priced into the stratosphere, is a nice functional design backed by dyno results and testing, and people still ***** and moan. The prototype pictures have been up for months, so the design shouldn't be a surprise. If you like the sealed ones, go get one of them, or alternatively, get those overpriced airbox spacers
Originally Posted by BMS
That's social media for you.
It's just a friendly discussion and this is how everyone on the forum who isn't a mechanical or electrical engineer learn. If you're not interested and just want to buy things with no knowledge on the subject, just go buy it and stop reading this thread. Some people just like to learn and understand what they're doing to their cars.
Please explain why AMG has compromised on their air intake system? According to these blogs they haven't learned the principles of basic air intake flow for maximum HP. I agree the stock air filter can be improved for flow, K&N and BMC, past that conversion there's not much to do unless the motor is radically tuned.
Simple, because AMG (and other OEMs) need to design a system that a) is dead quiet b) is reliable and holds replaceable paper filter elements.
You can’t have paper cones
Paper needs to be kept dry and protected
The sound baffling requires lots of plastic ducting restrictions, so the best that they can do is jam air in from where it enters under the hood.
Then you have to take into account CARB/emissions etc.
Once you throw non-paper elements into the mix, and throw out sound deadening and CARB, it absolutely opens things up for improvement in performance.
Last edited by ezatnova; Sep 25, 2019 at 10:22 AM.
It's just a friendly discussion and this is how everyone on the forum who isn't a mechanical or electrical engineer learn. If you're not interested and just want to buy things with no knowledge on the subject, just go buy it and stop reading this thread. Some people just like to learn and understand what they're doing to their cars.
lol...nice assumption that I have no knowledge on the subject.
Ezatnova covers many of the reasons why OEMs don't come with a less restrictive intake...same reason why it doesn't come from the factory running a 15psi tune. OEMs aren't chasing every last bit of performance and are after safety, reliability, reducing cost, aesthetics, etc. It's been shown over and over again on many platforms that what people love to knock as a "hot air intake" gains power when done properly, and BMS has experience in this area. They've even shown a Dyno of the gains they made. Could the design be even better? Probably. Would it cost more? Hell yes. They've done what they felt is the best solution balancing COST for the consumer and performance. That's pretty easy to understand...
From a business point, should offer both? If both as the same price, the enclosure airbox would definitely out sell the other. What is the #1 thing people complaining about the other design? Price !!!
Btw, what dyno result?
Oh looks like we never added the dyno to this thread... Stock intake vs BMS using same JB4 mapping. Note huge 30whp+ top end gains right where you'd expect them from reducing the inlet restriction.
From a business point, should offer both? If both as the same price, the enclosure airbox would definitely out sell the other. What is the #1 thing people complaining about the other design? Price !!!
Btw, what dyno result?
I like the approach of offering both options but this is just a really small market.
I like the approach of offering both options but this is just a really small market.
Since 75% of the designed already done. Not much more it take to design an enclosure box. Just keep the price down at half price of your lowest competitors and it will sell.
Do you know how high the air temp reached after repeated at full throttle run?
Oh looks like we never added the dyno to this thread... Stock intake vs BMS using same JB4 mapping. Note huge 30whp+ top end gains right where you'd expect them from reducing the inlet restriction.
This is what I am talking about. All the hot air/cold air debate and speculation doesn't matter compared to results.
Can you post the JB4 logs from these runs?
Also could you make my tubes red instead of black?
Last edited by LessIsMore; Sep 26, 2019 at 01:31 AM.
This is what I am talking about. All the hot air/cold air debate and speculation doesn't matter compared to results.
I can dyno my car and created a dyno chart how ever i want it to look like. It even easier with A boost controller like JB4. I and my friends Learned a big lesson about 10 years ago installed an aftermarket SC and was given with dyno chart showing 495 rwhp when we picked up our cars. They said no ECU tuned is need it. It felt like day and night and we were loving it. We gave them great reviews. When we independently dyno our cars, it was only making 325 rwhp. They apologized and finally tuned the car while I were there witness the tuning and saw it was making over 500 rwhp. On our first test driving. I took it on the freeway, floor it and my AMG engine blew up. Just to be clear, im not saying the dyno chart airbox posted is fake. My points is, dyno charts can be created how ever you want it to look.
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We're happy with the design and its performance over the last few months and several 1/2 mile airport races with our C63 and we're confident customers will really like this intake too. But like any modification it's not going to be for everyone.
