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2016 COMAND NTG 5s1 (5.1) RETROFIT from NGT4

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E-Class (W212) 2010 - 2016: E 350, E 550

2016 COMAND NTG 5s1 (5.1) RETROFIT from NGT4

 
Old 08-17-2016, 06:37 PM
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2016 COMAND NTG 5s1 (5.1) RETROFIT from NGT4


My 2016 COMAND NTG 5s1 retrofit into my 2010 W207.

































So???

What 2016 parts was needed SO FAR to do this retrofit from NTG4 to 5s1:

1. Comand 5s1 big version with built in HD navi
2. Screen
3. Video cable to screen
4. Repinning of cables in sockets
5. LAN antenna
6. H/K Amp
7. Camera and cablekit
8. Screen frame
9. New joystick with 4 buttons
10. Pincode
11. Maps with activation code

I am experimenting alot with programming and activating of menues. I got the AMG logo to start it of. And alot else so far.

So ALL that works now but

only PROBLEMS so far:

Navigation dont get a speed signal. So maps stop moving when it loses satelites.
Media dont showup in cluster. All else show up and work. Radio,Navi.phone...
AMG dails, then middle big one dont work. Guess it is also speed signal issue.
Camera dont send video


Last edited by Chris The Swede; 08-17-2016 at 07:09 PM.
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Old 08-17-2016, 06:55 PM
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So far when it comes to the speed signal all I can think of is the that it lacks the speed signal in the can bus and how to get it there I dont know right now..Working like hell to figure it out. All sugestions are welcome.

Also the Camera wont work. It activates but just says camera not avalible even though it is there and it is powered up and can be programmed. I wonder if it has to do with the PDC that suddenly can be seen by star diagnose after installing a new front sam. Guess it goes into a different place on the SAM....
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Old 08-17-2016, 07:05 PM
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Dammmm this look great! Good job on getting that retrofitted.
Now I am curious how easy it would be to retrofit this system into a 2012 W204.
How much programming did you had to do just to get the Comand system to work properly?
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Old 08-17-2016, 07:05 PM
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This is what I figured out so far of the rear.

And the pinout is as I think:

15 2.5mm Red and Blue +12v (20amp fused feed from F26 in front SAM)
12 2.5mm Brown, Ground
11 2.5mm Bround, Ground
9 0.75mm Blue and White. Mute input from E-Call or Telematics
16 0.5mm Blue/Black - MOST Wakeup

14 0.5mm Blue/Green = Wakeup output to the multimedia connection unit
13 Ground for multimedia connection unit BUT not used for codes 505/522/531 - But used if you have Telematics Service Unit
10 0.5mm Ground also goes to the multimedia connection unit

the black-12-pin subconnector (Connector C on the wiring diagram), it has 2 CAN connections
Body Can (Brown/Red to pin 9, and Brown to pin 3)
Telematics Can Black.White to pin 10, and Black to pin 4)
5,6,7,11,12 are the ethernet connection to the diagnostic socket for uploading online-manual from Star Diagnosis

Without Telematics CAN the display can not turn on

DISPLAY wiring - just in case this has changed
Pin 2 = +12v (red/white)
Pin 1 = Ground
Pin 8 = Telematics can black/white
pin 4 = Telematics can black
3,5,6,7 not connected
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Old 08-17-2016, 07:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Andriy242 View Post
Dammmm this look great! Good job on getting that retrofitted.
Now I am curious how easy it would be to retrofit this system into a 2012 W204.
How much programming did you had to do just to get the Comand system to work properly?
Its been done in W204...

Actually the NEEDED programming is just the anti theft pin code. The rest is optional..
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Old 08-17-2016, 07:18 PM
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this is almost too cool to post lol
im liking it a lot. great job
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Old 08-17-2016, 07:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris The Swede View Post


This is what I figured out so far of the rear.

And the pinout is as I think:

15 2.5mm Red and Blue +12v (20amp fused feed from F26 in front SAM)
12 2.5mm Brown, Ground
11 2.5mm Bround, Ground
9 0.75mm Blue and White. Mute input from E-Call or Telematics
16 0.5mm Blue/Black - MOST Wakeup

14 0.5mm Blue/Green = Wakeup output to the multimedia connection unit
13 Ground for multimedia connection unit BUT not used for codes 505/522/531 - But used if you have Telematics Service Unit
10 0.5mm Ground also goes to the multimedia connection unit

the black-12-pin subconnector (Connector C on the wiring diagram), it has 2 CAN connections
Body Can (Brown/Red to pin 9, and Brown to pin 3)
Telematics Can Black.White to pin 10, and Black to pin 4)
5,6,7,11,12 are the ethernet connection to the diagnostic socket for uploading online-manual from Star Diagnosis

Without Telematics CAN the display can not turn on

DISPLAY wiring - just in case this has changed
Pin 2 = +12v (red/white)
Pin 1 = Ground
Pin 8 = Telematics can black/white
pin 4 = Telematics can black
3,5,6,7 not connected
Based on the NTG4 rear, could the unknown green socket be TV tuner or AV IN/Rear Cam In? Are TV tuners even compatible with the new NTG 5.1 models?
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Old 08-17-2016, 08:06 PM
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You need a new tuner...
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Old 08-18-2016, 04:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Chris The Swede View Post
You need a new tuner...
Luckily I have not bought a TV tuner yet so I still have time to do the research on that one before I buy & install.
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Old 08-18-2016, 06:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Chris The Swede View Post
What 2016 parts was needed SO FAR to do this retrofit from NTG4 to 5s1:

9. New joystick with 4 buttons
Hi Chris, when you have a moment, Can you confirm what component the "new Joystick with 4 buttons" is? On most of the cars I've seen with NTG 5.1 it is the usual control wheel (5 directional) with two buttons, back & star?
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Old 08-18-2016, 07:15 AM
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Here it is installed.
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Old 08-18-2016, 07:22 AM
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The TV tuner for 5s1 is built in to the radio tuner as an option as I remebered.
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Old 08-18-2016, 08:35 AM
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Can you share the costs incurred so far for this upgrade? Looks sweet, plus my screen protector is banged up (scratched due to improper cleaner by prior owner) so maybe this is the motivation I need to do something about it
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Old 08-18-2016, 11:26 AM
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I am very interested in the swap for my CLS63 w218. I imagine if this works for w212, w218 should be similar. In for costs and fulsome list of parts
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Old 08-18-2016, 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by KLR CLS View Post
I am very interested in the swap for my CLS63 w218. I imagine if this works for w212, w218 should be similar. In for costs and fulsome list of parts
I had been looking at this as well (CLS W218) as W212 & W218 have same headunits, Chris helped prove it is possible but its clearly an extremely complex procedure with a lot of re-wiring needed not to mention how he has managed to reprogram and get system to accept all the re-coding.

When I asked retro-fitter in UK if this was possible they said flat out it could not ..."The unit simply wont work. the technology is different and during the installation process the system checks validity of part to chassis and NTG5 came much later. the coding will fail even if we could get it to talk to the car. Also we wouldn't be able to generate map pins as your chassis doesn't tally with an NTg5 car."

Given Chris has done the impossible ... He must be incredible talented at hacking the configuration! I have no Idea how he can update the Maps in the future given a map pin cannot be generated, is that perhaps one of the compromises Chris, you have to stay on the factory Maps or have you figured out some way to spoof the original VIN/codes from the car the retrofitted NTG 5.1 came from?

I'd love to know how Chris
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Old 08-18-2016, 02:02 PM
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There is no problem getting map pin codes. I updated mine with latest map. Or It would have never worked.
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Old 08-18-2016, 02:57 PM
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Originally Posted by gerardtoconnor View Post
I had been looking at this as well (CLS W218) as W212 & W218 have same headunits, Chris helped prove it is possible but its clearly an extremely complex procedure with a lot of re-wiring needed not to mention how he has managed to reprogram and get system to accept all the re-coding.

When I asked retro-fitter in UK if this was possible they said flat out it could not ..."The unit simply wont work. the technology is different and during the installation process the system checks validity of part to chassis and NTG5 came much later. the coding will fail even if we could get it to talk to the car. Also we wouldn't be able to generate map pins as your chassis doesn't tally with an NTg5 car."

Given Chris has done the impossible ... He must be incredible talented at hacking the configuration! I have no Idea how he can update the Maps in the future given a map pin cannot be generated, is that perhaps one of the compromises Chris, you have to stay on the factory Maps or have you figured out some way to spoof the original VIN/codes from the car the retrofitted NTG 5.1 came from?

I'd love to know how Chris
Ditto! I have the same situation and the same questions for Chris. Fancy a USA roadtrip? East coast between Washington DC and Philadelphia.
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Old 08-18-2016, 05:01 PM
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Well first I have to get to the USA....
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Old 08-18-2016, 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris The Swede View Post
Well first I have to get to the USA....
Consider this a personal invitation and a warm welcome from your fellow modders
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Old 08-18-2016, 05:53 PM
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Humble Thanx but can afford a trip like that.
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Old 08-18-2016, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris The Swede View Post
Humble Thanx but can afford a trip like that.
Perhaps a working road trip? Others could chime in if they would like some of your excellent mods performed on their MB's. I know I would love the full color instrument cluster, new AMG wheel and facelift upgrade of switches and AC vents....just like your car!
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Old 08-18-2016, 06:37 PM
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Thats awesome! I wish someone made kits for stuff like this. I had one hell of a time getting a system to work in my '06 G-500, I cant imagine the splicing and adapters needed for this.
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Old 08-18-2016, 08:39 PM
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Will this only work in the FL W204s? Or...is this somehow able to be retrofitted to the Pre FL with the pop-up screen?

NTG4.0 is the Pop-Up Screen on the Pre FL, no?
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Old 08-19-2016, 02:50 AM
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It works if the screen fits and I guess it should fit if W204 didnt have a uniqe screen bac then. Still the speed signal problem. But if you dont use navigation you are good. I have 2 units laying around without navigation. They use navi on a SD card instead of built in.
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Old 08-19-2016, 05:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Chris The Swede View Post
It works if the screen fits and I guess it should fit if W204 didnt have a uniqe screen bac then. Still the speed signal problem. But if you dont use navigation you are good. I have 2 units laying around without navigation. They use navi on a SD card instead of built in.
If you ever manage to figure out the speed signal issue, and you wanted a break in London (or were around there anyway), I'd be more then happy to cover everything (& time) to bring you over and help me mod my CLS! There are not too many people out there with your modding & coding skills! Appreciate your probably very busy but know the invitation is open and London only 2 hours away

Its a real pity your facing this hurdle on the speed signal, it seems unlikely the existing sensor is incompatible with NTG5.1 interface but have you managed to compare part numbers/spec from 2016 EClass to 2010 EClass to see if speed signal sensor is the same?

In relation to getting maps & unit to code correctly, do you need full Xentry/Star tools or is there anyway to code without that equipment through the inbuilt engineering menu or similar?
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