S-Class (W222) 2014-2020

M278 engine borescope inspection cast irone cyl barrels

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Rate Thread
 
Old 05-15-2024, 05:40 PM
  #1  
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
zenderV8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 51
Received 10 Likes on 10 Posts
S500 4matic L
M278 engine borescope inspection cast irone cyl barrels

Hello guys,

Just recently I have replaced all the spark plugs on my M278 engine
Here we have some photos of the cylinder barrel , car has 68k miles nicely done on highway.
At 30k miles Mercedes dealer had replaced all spar plus - all of them were fitted side-way so completely incorrect index.
According to engine production my engine has icast-iron cylinder barrels. Bellow photos are for references sorry for poor quality of the bore-scope camera a lot deepened on the light. Comments are very welcome.


Cylinder 1

Cylinder 2

Cylinde3

Cylinder4

Cylinder5

Cylinder 6

Cylinder7

Cylinder 8
Old 05-15-2024, 11:33 PM
  #2  
MBWorld Fanatic!
 
MBNUT1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 4,291
Received 1,019 Likes on 741 Posts
2010 E350 4Matic
Interesting. There was a post that showed different degrees of scoring and serviceability. What year is your car?
Old 05-16-2024, 12:42 AM
  #3  
MBWorld Fanatic!
 
JohnLane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 1,453
Received 546 Likes on 404 Posts
222 S-65
Looks normal.
Old 05-16-2024, 02:28 AM
  #4  
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
zenderV8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 51
Received 10 Likes on 10 Posts
S500 4matic L
Do you have a link to that post ? I couldn't found any photos of cast iron only movies on YT with Silitec

car production December 2015

When conducting a borescope inspection, one must be careful as it can take considerable time to capture a clear image. Initially, all of them may appear as new.
Old 05-16-2024, 05:36 PM
  #5  
MBWorld Fanatic!
 
Mitch Alsup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,050
Received 346 Likes on 226 Posts
S600
A) how many miles on the engine ?
B) how may miles between oil changes ?
Old 05-17-2024, 07:05 AM
  #6  
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
zenderV8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 51
Received 10 Likes on 10 Posts
S500 4matic L
A) how many miles on the engine ?
B) how may miles between oil changes ?

A ) same as engine 68k miles
B) 13k ,13k,13k, 6k,6k,6k,6k - simply once a year

Driving 6,000 miles on the highway in a year, the oil level remains stable, so no additional oil is required.

Old 05-17-2024, 08:38 PM
  #7  
MBWorld Fanatic!
 
Mitch Alsup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,050
Received 346 Likes on 226 Posts
S600
Originally Posted by zenderV8
B) 13k ,13k,13k, 6k,6k,6k,6k - simply once a year
Looks like you pushed your luck a little too far with 13K OCIs.
Old 05-18-2024, 02:27 AM
  #8  
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
zenderV8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 51
Received 10 Likes on 10 Posts
S500 4matic L
Lightbulb

Originally Posted by Mitch Alsup
Looks like you pushed your luck a little too far with 13K OCIs.
13k is a factor recommendation that was done at the first three years of the car. Some of the barrels have minor wear or none at all with cast iron. I think we should be looking into wear out of the piston ring now.
Old 05-18-2024, 06:52 AM
  #9  
Out Of Control!!

 
chassis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: unbegrenzt
Posts: 13,392
Received 3,963 Likes on 3,116 Posts
2017 GLE350 4MATIC
People with iron lined engines probably aren’t bore scoping their engines looking for scoring. Could be one of the reasons not many videos can be found.
Old 05-18-2024, 05:09 PM
  #10  
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
zenderV8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 51
Received 10 Likes on 10 Posts
S500 4matic L
Originally Posted by chassis
People with iron lined engines probably aren’t bore scoping their engines looking for scoring. Could be one of the reasons not many videos can be found.
Well that is true for sure However issues with excessive wear out of cylinder barrels lays down to few factor not only surface material used. One of the reasons bent sometimes even twisted connecting rods from factory
The following users liked this post:
MBNUT1 (05-18-2024)
Old 05-19-2024, 12:09 AM
  #11  
MBWorld Fanatic!
 
BenzV12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,916
Received 624 Likes on 471 Posts
W212 FL
I'm not expert by any means but given the robustness of a well maintained Mercedes-Benz engines , I don't think there's any excessive wear and tear marks in your engine either .
I like your detective work though
The following users liked this post:
zenderV8 (05-19-2024)
Old 05-19-2024, 05:40 PM
  #12  
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
zenderV8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 51
Received 10 Likes on 10 Posts
S500 4matic L
Thank you very much for your input in this post.
Tomorrow I will send the lube oil sample for full analysis. We will see what comes out of that.
Old 05-20-2024, 09:10 AM
  #13  
MBWorld Fanatic!
 
JohnLane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 1,453
Received 546 Likes on 404 Posts
222 S-65
If you are concerned about bent rods....

This engine using Direct injection? If so give it fresh injectors. DI injectors famously fail to spraying 100% of the time for a large puddle of fuel in the cylinder that upon startup makes for a bent rod. Another failure being a poor fuel spray pattern that makes for uneven spray that makes detonation that makes.... You guessed it... Bent rods... and scratched up cylinders with broken ring lands.
Old 05-20-2024, 10:20 AM
  #14  
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
zenderV8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 51
Received 10 Likes on 10 Posts
S500 4matic L
Originally Posted by JohnLane
If you are concerned about bent rods....

This engine using Direct injection? If so give it fresh injectors. DI injectors famously fail to spraying 100% of the time for a large puddle of fuel in the cylinder that upon startup makes for a bent rod. Another failure being a poor fuel spray pattern that makes for uneven spray that makes detonation that makes.... You guessed it... Bent rods... and scratched up cylinders with broken ring lands.
Yes - DI unfortunately for the inlet valve . I've already checked the price from the dealer; it's about $150/item with a discount inc, which is very attractive compared to the price of a diesel injector valve. An incorrect fuel ratio can exhibit various symptoms; subsequent oil analyses will ascertain whether there is a reason to proceed with new measures.
A well-known issue was the poor quality of BMW's injector valves, which led to complete engine failure before even reaching 50,000 miles, that really put mu out of shopping for BMW7
Old 05-21-2024, 09:09 AM
  #15  
MBWorld Fanatic!
 
JohnLane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 1,453
Received 546 Likes on 404 Posts
222 S-65
Soooo an injector that sprays atop the intake valves or that sprays directly into the combustion chamber? I have not had a 5.5 liter TT apart yet. Port injection is essentially trouble free these days. Same cannot be said for Direct infected engines.

Wonder who makes DI injectors for BMW and MB? Nickel in a bet says same manufacturer.

MB has enough failures with them. Don't let your engine be one of them. $1200 now seems as relatively cheap insurance. Be sure to get all the one use items to go with.

Last edited by JohnLane; 05-21-2024 at 09:13 AM.
Old 05-21-2024, 09:16 AM
  #16  
Out Of Control!!
 
PeterUbers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 11,857
Received 2,080 Likes on 1,451 Posts
2014 E63S; AMS 100 octane ecu tune; edok tcu tune; BB intakes; dyno tuned
Mb document on cylinder scoring "acceptablity"
https://mbworld.org/forums/attachmen...-nanoslide.pdf

check out the m157 sticky for all things m157 and usually m278 on the w212 amg sub forum

https://mbworld.org/forums/w212-amg/...2-amg-e63.html


m157 discussion on scoring:
https://mbworld.org/forums/w212-amg/...ight-help.html
The following 2 users liked this post by PeterUbers:
MBNUT1 (05-21-2024), zenderV8 (05-22-2024)
Old 06-09-2024, 05:32 PM
  #17  
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
zenderV8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 51
Received 10 Likes on 10 Posts
S500 4matic L
Spoiler
 
Originally Posted by JohnLane

Wonder who makes DI injectors for BMW and MB? Nickel in a bet says same manufacturer.

MB has enough failures with them. Don't let your engine be one of them. $1200 now seems as relatively cheap insurance. Be sure to get all the one use items to go with.
Just a general update. There is no contamination from fuel or soot . Chromium Iron aluminum lead tin etc all at very low level. However OEM oil show up very poor quality after 9 000 km (1y) so , the idea is to change to Millers oil EE PERFORMANCE 5w40

I wonder if I might mention that there is a short movie where one of the mechanics declares that he has never seen cast iron barrels. This suggests that they may not be addressing the bore-scoring issues that have been observed on Silitec barrels. 4.25 s

Old 06-09-2024, 08:32 PM
  #18  
Out Of Control!!

 
chassis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: unbegrenzt
Posts: 13,392
Received 3,963 Likes on 3,116 Posts
2017 GLE350 4MATIC
Originally Posted by JohnLane
Soooo an injector that sprays atop the intake valves or that sprays directly into the combustion chamber? I have not had a 5.5 liter TT apart yet. Port injection is essentially trouble free these days. Same cannot be said for Direct infected engines.

Wonder who makes DI injectors for BMW and MB? Nickel in a bet says same manufacturer.

MB has enough failures with them. Don't let your engine be one of them. $1200 now seems as relatively cheap insurance. Be sure to get all the one use items to go with.
Bosch is one of the largest producers of injectors. Interesting graphic showing dual port+DI injection.

https://www.bosch-mobility.com/en/so...ect-injection/

The following users liked this post:
zenderV8 (06-10-2024)
Old 06-10-2024, 12:00 AM
  #19  
MBWorld Fanatic!
 
JohnLane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 1,453
Received 546 Likes on 404 Posts
222 S-65
Port and direct injection.... Toyota does this to good effect. Hope that MB does as well.

Modern engine management done right is black magic that allows us to make F-1 levels of power/liter in a four door car with a warranty. So long as it doesn't go wrong.
Ask it to make the power they are able to and have an injector go lean (so one cylinder) and we have holes in a piston in no time.
The following users liked this post:
chassis (06-10-2024)
Old 06-10-2024, 09:40 AM
  #20  
Junior Member
Thread Starter
 
zenderV8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 51
Received 10 Likes on 10 Posts
S500 4matic L
Originally Posted by JohnLane
Port and direct injection.... Toyota does this to good effect. Hope that MB does as well.

Modern engine management done right is black magic that allows us to make F-1 levels of power/liter in a four door car with a warranty. So long as it doesn't go wrong.
Ask it to make the power they are able to and have an injector go lean (so one cylinder) and we have holes in a piston in no time.

Well I do have that engine in RC 300H : New 2.5-liter Direct-injection, Inline 4-cylinder Gasoline Engine, unfortunately only by first 6 months the fuel consumption met what Lexus declared , now after 6 year and 70miles its takes 40% more which is 33 miles/ gallon. Increase consumption obviously is a result of engine condition. I do fully agree with you duel injection port and DI looks to be the best solution at that point.
The following users liked this post:
chassis (06-10-2024)

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 


You have already rated this thread Rating: Thread Rating: 0 votes,  average.

Quick Reply: M278 engine borescope inspection cast irone cyl barrels



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:08 PM.