83mm or 80mm Pulley Clutched.
10-10-2018, 04:19 PM
#51
10-10-2018, 07:47 PM
#52
MBWorld Fanatic!
I agree with the PB5 comment, if the price is too good to be true...
10-10-2018, 08:49 PM
#53
Former Vendor of MBWorld
There are still people here that think the CM30 is a good pump and the PLM HE is an upgrade, so its really not worth my time to reprove these points over and over when they have been discussed in other threads.
10-10-2018, 09:14 PM
#54
MBWorld Fanatic!
Yes... The test results for all of our cooling setups have been posted multiple times across mbworld. feel free to use the search feature. typical drops of 8-10* with the secondary, Superflo further boosts the cooling capabilities.
There are still people here that think the CM30 is a good pump and the PLM HE is an upgrade, so its really not worth my time to reprove these points over and over when they have been discussed in other threads.
There are still people here that think the CM30 is a good pump and the PLM HE is an upgrade, so its really not worth my time to reprove these points over and over when they have been discussed in other threads.
You don't have to re-prove anything. Just post the link if you have a specific thread in mind.
10-10-2018, 09:18 PM
#55
Super Member
Thread Starter
Yes... The test results for all of our cooling setups have been posted multiple times across mbworld. feel free to use the search feature. typical drops of 8-10* with the secondary, Superflo further boosts the cooling capabilities.
There are still people here that think the CM30 is a good pump and the PLM HE is an upgrade, so its really not worth my time to reprove these points over and over when they have been discussed in other threads.
There are still people here that think the CM30 is a good pump and the PLM HE is an upgrade, so its really not worth my time to reprove these points over and over when they have been discussed in other threads.
10-10-2018, 09:29 PM
#56
Former Vendor of MBWorld
That's pretty vague information, thanks. I guess I will just remain ignorant then, I'm not searching through all your threads. The only ones I know about are members testing your secondary exchanger with an aftermarket one and finding next to no benefit except under specific circumstances few will care about. Last time I checked you sell the PLM, good to know you stock products you consider useless upgrades. I also remember seeing worse results using the superflow on a simple single heat exchanger setup vs the Bosch and only finding the benefits with tanks or multiple exchangers.
You don't have to re-prove anything. Just post the link if you have a specific thread in mind.
You don't have to re-prove anything. Just post the link if you have a specific thread in mind.
the PLM is a FACTORY REPLACEMENT heat exchanger, we have said it a million times.
The results of a secondary are close to those of adding a trunk tank in multiple circumstances. you want lower cruising? got it. lower peak? got it, lower starting? got it. what else do you want?
there are faster and faster 55s hitting the street everyday, and then there are people who spend their lives on the forum doubting everything and asking for 16 dyno sheets, a presidential seal of approval, the exact weight in newtons and the half life of the materials used... its Motorsports not rocket science. we dont sell **** that doesnt work. we spend 10s of thousands of dollars every year on product development.
for the $20 we are making on each secondary heat exchanger....
10-10-2018, 09:33 PM
#57
MBWorld Fanatic!
i have a thread here of just adding the secondary and after weeks of watching IAT’s before and after there is no doubt atleast in my observation in recovery times and stop and go traffic plus IAT’s rising slower have improved my cooling. Didn’t notice peak temps being cooler soo much. In my case it made a difference. I think people are expecting a drastic increase and you won’t get drastic till you go to a killer chiller.
In terms of the secondary exchanger with a stock one, I haven't seen anything to show this is better than a single aftermarket front mount. However if it is actually better it might be a great alternative to cutting up the airflow shrouds and drilling into the bumper bar.
10-10-2018, 09:48 PM
#58
Super Member
Thread Starter
I don't know about anyone else but I am not expecting anything. I just want to see there is a significant tangible performance improvement and that it can justify the price. I was considering a secondary exchanger until the latest reviews by members here. Apologies if I am thinking of the wrong thread but I seem to remember you saying there was a tiny improvement in recovery, negligible peak IAT improvement and the only truely improvement of note was in stop/go traffic. And that it was not worth the cost.
In terms of the secondary exchanger with a stock one, I haven't seen anything to show this is better than a single aftermarket front mount. However if it is actually better it might be a great alternative to cutting up the airflow shrouds and drilling into the bumper bar.
In terms of the secondary exchanger with a stock one, I haven't seen anything to show this is better than a single aftermarket front mount. However if it is actually better it might be a great alternative to cutting up the airflow shrouds and drilling into the bumper bar.
i understand and know were your coming from. On my second day of driving I reported back on that thread and mentioned that in my opinion and observation it did drop IAT’s in stop and go, recovery time was definitely better and later I reported back mentioning the iat’s also climbed up slower, I did not notice a change or anything worth mentioning in peak IAT’s which for some reason I was expecting. Initially No, I did t have good feedback. That was due to not having enough seat time when I was coming home from the install shop, phone battery died and just couldn’t get enough data. It did take one day of driving and when I went to work the following day I noticed it and waited till I drove back home in hotter temps to post my final observation of the secondary heat exchanger. I’m still looking and monitoring my IAT’s and just as I said in the areas it made a difference it still is. Im not at all biased and honestly was not expecting much to begin with and my cost out of pocket may not be worth it to some because I paid a high labor cost to install it then most would have. If I could’ve gotten it installed for a lot less then I would say ya for sure it’s worth it but in the end it’s my fault for paying what i paid for labor cost and no one else’s.
10-10-2018, 10:18 PM
#59
Super Member
Thing is, unless it keeps my peak temps down during a 1/4 mile at the minimum what is the point? A few degrees C around town or at idle isn't really worthy $$$ to me. Recovery is great and all, but realistically recovery is not terrible with 010 and a upgraded HE, could it be better? Sure. But the problem is if I am tracking the car, I'm hitting 72 degrees Celsius (in 12C ambient, I don't even want to know what it gets to in summer 30C heat..). I am going to the drags on the 21st and imagine I'll be pulling timing before I hit the end of the quarter mile due to high IATs.
Killer chiller, meth, iced expansion tank and black benz's custom inter cooler setup seems to be the only ways to actually meaningfully impact the cooling circuit to achieve these things AFAIK. The rest are all 'it does a little' but doesn't really help especially when you overdrive charger..
Honestly, it mystifies me that these online vendors don't take the time to perform customer service. If your unwilling to provide information about your products time and time again but just duplicate posts trying to sell Sh*t I definitely will not be buying from you, because the customers you're fishing for are punks and I aint no b*tch.
Killer chiller, meth, iced expansion tank and black benz's custom inter cooler setup seems to be the only ways to actually meaningfully impact the cooling circuit to achieve these things AFAIK. The rest are all 'it does a little' but doesn't really help especially when you overdrive charger..
Honestly, it mystifies me that these online vendors don't take the time to perform customer service. If your unwilling to provide information about your products time and time again but just duplicate posts trying to sell Sh*t I definitely will not be buying from you, because the customers you're fishing for are punks and I aint no b*tch.
10-11-2018, 01:05 AM
#60
Former Vendor of MBWorld
Thing is, unless it keeps my peak temps down during a 1/4 mile at the minimum what is the point? A few degrees C around town or at idle isn't really worthy $$$ to me. Recovery is great and all, but realistically recovery is not terrible with 010 and a upgraded HE, could it be better? Sure. But the problem is if I am tracking the car, I'm hitting 72 degrees Celsius (in 12C ambient, I don't even want to know what it gets to in summer 30C heat..). I am going to the drags on the 21st and imagine I'll be pulling timing before I hit the end of the quarter mile due to high IATs.
Killer chiller, meth, iced expansion tank and black benz's custom inter cooler setup seems to be the only ways to actually meaningfully impact the cooling circuit to achieve these things AFAIK. The rest are all 'it does a little' but doesn't really help especially when you overdrive charger..
Honestly, it mystifies me that these online vendors don't take the time to perform customer service. If your unwilling to provide information about your products time and time again but just duplicate posts trying to sell Sh*t I definitely will not be buying from you, because the customers you're fishing for are punks and I aint no b*tch.
Killer chiller, meth, iced expansion tank and black benz's custom inter cooler setup seems to be the only ways to actually meaningfully impact the cooling circuit to achieve these things AFAIK. The rest are all 'it does a little' but doesn't really help especially when you overdrive charger..
Honestly, it mystifies me that these online vendors don't take the time to perform customer service. If your unwilling to provide information about your products time and time again but just duplicate posts trying to sell Sh*t I definitely will not be buying from you, because the customers you're fishing for are punks and I aint no b*tch.
10-11-2018, 02:11 AM
#62
MBWorld Fanatic!
This is my point exactly. literally everything you just said is wrong and bad information. You should reeducate yourself on how the cooling system works. I have NEVER EVER heard of a customer having worse results with a superflo than a 010, infact i dont even see how that is possible.... so much so that we are going for an even more powerful pump than the superflo because of how well it has performed.
the PLM is a FACTORY REPLACEMENT heat exchanger, we have said it a million times.
The results of a secondary are close to those of adding a trunk tank in multiple circumstances. you want lower cruising? got it. lower peak? got it, lower starting? got it. what else do you want?
there are faster and faster 55s hitting the street everyday, and then there are people who spend their lives on the forum doubting everything and asking for 16 dyno sheets, a presidential seal of approval, the exact weight in newtons and the half life of the materials used... its Motorsports not rocket science. we dont sell **** that doesnt work. we spend 10s of thousands of dollars every year on product development.
for the $20 we are making on each secondary heat exchanger....
the PLM is a FACTORY REPLACEMENT heat exchanger, we have said it a million times.
The results of a secondary are close to those of adding a trunk tank in multiple circumstances. you want lower cruising? got it. lower peak? got it, lower starting? got it. what else do you want?
there are faster and faster 55s hitting the street everyday, and then there are people who spend their lives on the forum doubting everything and asking for 16 dyno sheets, a presidential seal of approval, the exact weight in newtons and the half life of the materials used... its Motorsports not rocket science. we dont sell **** that doesnt work. we spend 10s of thousands of dollars every year on product development.
for the $20 we are making on each secondary heat exchanger....
his means faster flow rates and improved cooling efficiency!
I am glad I am full of wrong information. I won't ask for specific examples since you can't even do me the courtesy of posting the information regarding your claim (about stock HE + secondary being better than just stock upgrade) above that you are adamant exists in multiple threads.... the purpose of which could net you sales. "Factory replacement"? I think we are going to be arguing about the definition of words here. I see anything that replaces the factory heat exchanger as a "factory replacement", everything from PLM, frozen boost, DTM, eurocharged and your V2 also. Your V2 holds "almost 2L" of fluid. The PLM holds 1.8L and I believe stock is about 1L and somehow the PLM is now rubbish? Its not even an upgrade, just a replacement.
I know I am being unreasonable. I don't need a dyno of a heat exchanger, tank or pump. 16 dyno pages is unnecessary but at least one would be nice for claims of power adding mods. I am sure President Trump has spare time between tweets but once again I don't feel the need to bother him in regards to your products. A simple comparison of IAT's on the same car, similar weather and clearly stating which variables were changed would suffice. I hope you actually have an E55 to test products on. I think this exercise would take an afternoon to have all the scientific measurements to support your product.... and make a sale.... or not.
I notice that this bickering doesn't seem to happen with eurocharged, raceiq, shardul etc.
10-11-2018, 09:06 AM
#63
Former Vendor of MBWorld
the secondary can be used in conjunction with any heat exchanger. If you have a cm30 or a 003 your car is going to cool less efficiently because both of those pumps are garbage as we know and the added resistance makes it even worse. 010 and superflo are fine.
cavitation and "over flowing" should not even be a topic. I dont know why it keeps popping up but it's becoming a flat earth theory. So I'm not even going to address it. We keep adding faster pumps and temps keep dropping. So if youd like keep your cm30s have at it.
10-11-2018, 10:07 AM
#65
MBWorld Fanatic!
Looking forward to intercooler options! Preferably one that fits under the blower, AND a big top mount system for the guys who want to go all out.
10-11-2018, 06:18 PM
#66
People ,these cars are not summer car's.
If your looking to make power and drive them wot with full gains ,your falling sort of your goals.
If your looking to make power and drive them wot with full gains ,your falling sort of your goals.
You need a kc,meth ,5 gallon tank and a larger he to even battle this and actually, the stock he does more then fine with a large pump as in the hot days it don't soak as long sitting.
The issue with this car is the intercooler as I said many times.The 80mm vs a 77 mm is close to the same power but you'll run cooler with the 80
The issue with this car is the intercooler as I said many times.The 80mm vs a 77 mm is close to the same power but you'll run cooler with the 80
Last edited by oneslow55; 10-11-2018 at 07:33 PM.
10-11-2018, 06:32 PM
#67
People ,these cars are not summer car's.
If your looking to make power and drive them wot with full gains ,your falling sort of your goals.
If your looking to make power and drive them wot with full gains ,your falling sort of your goals.
You need a kc,meth ,5 gallon tank and a larger he to even battle this and actually, the stock he does more then fine with a large pump as in the hot days it don't soak as long sitting.
The issue with this car is the intercooler as I said many times.The 80mm vs a 77 mm is close to the same power but you'll run cooler with the 77.
The issue with this car is the intercooler as I said many times.The 80mm vs a 77 mm is close to the same power but you'll run cooler with the 77.
