MB_Forever

As some of you may already know, EuroElites (once a reputable tuner on this site), has been involved in a big mess where two customers' cars have been damaged, major parts have been replaced, both parties aparently not satisfied, and now even a possibility that both sides may be engaged in legal action

Throughout the dramatic thread, more and more un-happy customers seem to surface and speak out about their bad experiences from EuroElites.

Here is the controversial thread:

https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/229113-tunning-horrific-nightmare.html

I'd like to hear some of your comments and feedback about this, but please keep them in this thread.

mdncn2762

If I owned either one of the two vehicles I would be highly upset. I would take every possible action to get my vehicle fixed. If that means going the legal route than thats just how it is. All tuner shops should be bonded, licensed and insured anyway, especially working on MB vehicles. It sounds alot like, "He said, she said" type stuff anyway. Where is the fine print on the work order? What does it say? Gather your facts and proceed. But thats just me.

dkallencat1

Who in their right mind would want to take there car to EE in the future after this, I no I sure the hell wouldn't. They are history as far as I am concern.

bud4ya

I am doing a double take on doing and ECU and pulley upgrade. Scary SH**

bud4ya

Think it would be safer to just do a pulley with no ECU tune? If the only thing the tune does is provide more power and better fuel economy I will skip the ecu tune. But if the ecu tune is needed to help with the correct A/F ratio I guess it is a must.

Just scares me now to mess with the ECU. If you can just switch the pulleys with no ecu tune with no adverse side effects I would be fine with that. If they ecu tune just helps the pulleys achieve even more HP I will skip the ecu part.

I was all excited to tune the ecu now i do not think I will. Makes my rim scratch look like a drop in the bucket.

Thanks

splinter

That thread aired a lot of dirty laundry and brought to the fore some deeply felt beliefs’. It was an unfortunate set of circumstances that played out in front of all of us. Was there incompetence, poor judgment, a lack of due diligence, and perhaps negligence on the part of both the OP and EE? Yes.

When problems arise in my business, as they inevitably do, I’ll do everything in my power to make things right. Am I always successful? Of course not. I can take comfort in knowing I gave it my best shot, and then let the chips fall where they may. The vast majority thank me when cutting their final check. It’s a livelihood built on personal referrals.

I have always enjoyed modifying my cars for improved performance. When they broke, which they seemed to do with alarming regularity early on, I had to fix them myself. My father taught me how to handle a wrench. It is a skill set that I’m thankful to have acquired, as I still enjoy spending time in the garage today.

Friends and I blew up more engines than I care to remember from the curse of having an insatiable desire to wring out more horsepower, or shave a tenth or two off our ET's. That was two decades ago, but the fit can hit the shan almost as easily today. Too lean and too much advance is an engine killer. Our MB ECU/TCU tuning parameter codes are very sophisticated. IMHO, they are not to be entrusted to any amateur or dilettante. From a hardware perspective, LET has far exceeded my expectations from a niche aftermarket manufacturer. Their pieces are of very high quality. I couldn’t be more pleased. They are a welcome and respected asset to our forum, as is VRP. When my buildup has progressed to the point of needing a tune to fully exploit its performance, only they will do it.

boohooramblers

+1 John (and thanks to those aftermarket guys who are respected).

I've followed that thread from the start and several important issues have arisen from this fiasco that disturb me:

1. Too many customers form personal bonds with their tuners/mod shops to the point that when something goes wrong, they keep quiet about it. This completely negates the purpose of having a good forum like MBWorld.
This forum, to me, is exactly the place to share your experiences with modifications, repairs, stories, and projects. I seriously thought that everyone would have learned something when the AMGSC / HPS saga transpired.

2. It seems like the tuner's / modifier's responsibility after working on a vehicle is a dirty little secret. Ted Baldwin has repeatedly posed the question early in the EE thread:
What are you (the tuner / shop) going to do when a negative outcome arises?
Nobody has stepped up to the plate to answer it. In fact, somebody seems to think that modifying your car is akin to gambling in 'Vegas. Really? I have a real problem with this type of mentality. If that's the consensus regarding aftermarket modifications, then I'm definitely calling it quits on modd'ing my car (before I start!).
We all know that there are certain Sponsors on this forum who will absolutely do everything they can to rectify the situation, but it seems as if there are some who treat some people differently.

3. It appears that there are too many threads with aftermarket modifications that don't have nearly enough empirical evidence / data to warrant their popularity. Fortunately, this generally doesn't apply to the C32 forum. Maybe it's the scientist mentality in me, but if you don't have the right controls (e.g. baseline data), why bother doing it at all?
As alluded to several times in the EE thread, we all know our motors are somewhat different. Sometimes there is a pretty wide variation between different motors in the same model. My point is this - why would anyone purchase and settle for a 'one-size-fits-all' tune without obtaining the appropriate datalogging for YOUR car?

4. 'A little knowledge is a very dangerous thing'. This applies to work and play. The EE thread demonstrates ignorance on the part of both the tuner and the customer. I do not say 'ignorance' in an offensive way here. Again, there are exceptions to my statement and several sponsors and forum members here really know their stuff. That's what I dig about this forum.
That said, there are too many 'tuners' who don't appear to know what they are doing. John rightly alluded to the fact that our ECU systems are very complex. Aside from a select few here, who really knows the 'safe' parameters that govern our engine management systems? I know that in the grand scheme of things, I don't know squat. We all have our fortes. BUT..... when you fork out money to someone who claims they know what they're doing, you ought to have a very reasonable expectation of a non-catastrophic outcome. If the outcome is bad, fair enough - 'you break it, you FIX IT'.

A little naive on my part, but that's my take on it.

jturkel

hey. in case you were wondering, i currently am running an evosport pulley with no ecu tune or chip. ive been running this way for at least 5 months with no problems whatsoever.

FrankW

if those were my cars I wouldn't have used some EVOtech ECU tuning. It's Brabus, Carlsson, or say Evosport which is more estabilished from their E55 experiences doing a lot of members' rides.

FrankW

running only the pulley should have no problems except at the top of the rpm range you'll feel the engine is gasping for some air since the increased boost isn't ideal for the stock fuel map.

cnchung

Read the story, very poor tuner, wasted everybody's time

bud4ya

I think that is the route I am going to take now. Last thing I want or need is a blown tranny, SC or engine.

cnchung

and front spoiler too!!!

bud4ya

Will the poor ratio on the higher RPMS lead to engine, sc or tranny prob's down the road? Or is it so min that it will not matter? Maybe those with C32's with just a pulley can chime in and let me know how many miles they have put on the pulley set up (Which One) with no ECU tuning.

Thanks Jturkel for your numbers

bud4ya

Last time I brought mine to the dealer the f*** up the rims and scrathes in the bumper and I flipped about that.

They did fix the rims to the cond they were in though

MRAMG1

DO IT my friend. The PULLEY alone REALLY wakes the car up On my G-tech it showed I made 31 more HP. The raods were toooo cold to get any good 0-60, or 1/4 times. But I can say WITH NO DOUBT, the car really responded well to JUST a pulley. Okay I did the HE as well, but this is not a performace piece. It's simply a consistcy piece.

By the way, I do TRUST LET. I have spoken personnaly with Erick and Jerry, MANY times. And they have given me GOOD/SOLID advice, even concerning products that they do not sell. They are honest/professional peolpe. I fell VERY comfortable that they will be checking ALL tunes that they sell, and will not leave their customers stranded like __

See yeah

bud4ya

I was considering the LET pulley but I am trying to be conserative on the boost. I think their pulley set up is like 3 PSI more than the others. Which is great selling point but not if you are conserative. I have heard nothing but good things on LET items on this board (Top Notch Service and Products). I should check if they have a smaller pulley like the other manf's. I have also been eyeing out some used ones.

I hope some people chime in with mileage they have racked up with just a pulley and no tune. I would like to see at least a handful of people with like 10,000 miles plus on just a pulley set up.


Thanks

Derspeed

What a nightmare. After all of that, however, he still had them do more work and was surprised when the brake parts were wrong.

cnchung

Dealers were never good. They once swapped wheels from my dad's W140, I knew about it because i do wash the car for him. Told Dad and we finally got a set new. (Anyway, a bit off topic here, but worth to mention)

FrankW

might hurt the spark plugs that's my guess.

i ran it without ecu for couple months. didn't have much problem.

bud4ya

If that is the only issue that may happen with no tune with pulleys than I am good with that. Just replace them every $5k or so

MRAMG1

I wouldn't worry about the plugs, with only a 3 pound boost increase. I left mine alone, ie heat range. Now if you buy LET's BIGGEST puley, then YES I would DEFINITELY go ONE step colder. Our cars have a pretty cold plug to begin with, as does ANY F/I car from the factory. I will pull mine at the end of the race season, yust for piece of mind, but I'll take the bets now that they will be fine. ANyone want to wanger

See yeah

PS: You do know that LET sells, 3 differnt sizes right

MRAMG1

Oh yeah, I bought my pulley from E-bay, its the Evospsot knock off, 3 more pounds of boost is the claim. I have NO way of monitoring it, so I am taking their numbers as is.

See yeah

bud4ya

I should do some research. I thought LET only sold the larger pulley that provided 3 more PSI over and beyond what a ASP or Evo provides you. I will take a look at their smaller one

bud4ya

The bigger LET pulley is susposed to give you evn another 3 PSI over and beyond what the Evosport and ASP give you