Originally Posted by Improviz

Wow, I guess that 60 pounds would mean a win!! Yeah, that's it....man, 60 pounds will definitely knock what, ten seconds off your 80-150 time?? Yup, that's definitely worth all of the effort you expended there, chief!

Originally Posted by Zlicious

Hello everyone..

Well, I was informed that this thread was taking place a week ago and decided not to get into the whole deal because I AM VERY AWARE THAT Jangy's 500 RWHP E55 KILL IS VERY, VERY PLAUSABLE... Why is it plausible? Because a race is ALWAYS driver dependant, ALWAYS!!! So, good kill.

Now, if you never argued that your car is not faster than the Z06, and you understand that you beat the driver, then I am sorry for the upcoming blabbing. But, if you honestly feel that your 500 rwhp car is faster than a properly driven, stock Z06, read along.


let's get some FACTS straight. Fact is that NO 500 rwhp E55 is going to beat a WELL DRIVEN, even STOCK Z06. It just won't happen. An E55 doesn't defy the laws of physics.

I have raced a 490 rwhp E55 (video was posted within the first few pages by Improviz) and you saw the outcome. That outcome is sound and makes sense. 460 rwhp car @ 3080 lbs vs. a 490 rwhp car @ 4000 lbs. So, why is it that when a 500 rwhp E55 beats a, lets say, 445 rwhp Z06, people jump down the posters throat and call BS? Because the outcome, unlike mine, is not sound and makes no sense. Hence, the "you beat the driver" comments are evolved. Think about it for a second. Do you REALLY think that a 4000 lb+ car with 500 rwhp is going to outrun a PROPERLY DRIVEN, 445 rwhp, 3130 lb car that has optimal gearing from 50-160? If you can HONESTLY say "Yes", then, well, you are in denial. Because it WON’T happen.

Good kill, but you beat the driver not the car. It happens, and it happens a lot.

P.S.-I live in MI and I have 520 rwhp in my Z06. Jrcart, I see you have a 500+ hp Benz. Given the outcome of Jangy's race, you should be able to pull my 520 rwhp Z06, right? Right!! I am willing to drive half way and meet with you for a race, just a friendly one, while maybe getting some dinner or just hanging out. Besides, my sister lives in Chicago and I will be visiting her soon anyways. Let me know if you want to set this up and we can have some fun.

Originally Posted by enzom

Why is this still going on?

Weight - Should be pretty easy to figure out roughly what the difference in car weights is. - Have people post their actual E55 weights. Mine has been around 4,300 - 4,340 with me in it, depending on how much fuel I am carrying. Post on the Corvetteforum and ask what their C6Z06's have weighed at the track. I am sure that you will have a dozen responses in a day. I suspect that the difference will be between 700 and 800 lbs., but if someone really wants to put an end to this, it can be done.

RWHP - We know what Jangy's car dyno'd at, so that should not be in debate. As for the Z06. Search on the Corvetteforum. I have seen ranges of 440 - 470 , but post up on that board and ask for SAE dynojet RWHP readings. You'll get your answer.

Forget magazines, forget manufacturers's websites. Get actual data. And get an ESTIMATE. Bantering back and forth over 60 lbs? What sort of precision do people think they will find?

And if you are going to question the responses you get from owners about how true the information is, it is a two way street. You will have to do the best with what you get.

Originally Posted by sack5000

3,160 lbs. with gas on the track scales as noted by Z06 member, as for the RWHP they claim that 440-470 is within the range. Also, 1/4 mile times in the 11.5 @ 124 range for the Z06.

Originally Posted by juicee63

The very best Z06 run may be better than the very best 55( all motor pass) but the averages are very close. A 55 or 63 needs at least 80 extra ponies to hang with a stock Z that is properly driven.

stock for stock Z whacks the E but modded , I know the 55 can stay right with the Z06.

Not taking anything away from Jaime or Ranger but comparing those times to Z06's being driven in So Cal is unfair. The best California Speedway stock Z time is 11.6X@121. I dunno if Jangy can run 11.60's but he ought to trap 119-121 as other modded 55's have at Fontana!!

Hey Jangy you can show up 6/13/2008 and we can race a Z heads up , post it here in this thread and put an end to all the babble

www.alternativemotoring.com

Originally Posted by transferred

You mean non-nitrous? 55k's are FI

Originally Posted by juicee63

Not taking anything away from Jaime or Ranger but comparing those times to Z06's being driven in So Cal is unfair. The best California Speedway stock Z time is 11.6X@121. I dunno if Jangy can run 11.60's but he ought to trap 119-121 as other modded 55's have at Fontana!!

Originally Posted by E55JAY

stop paper racing^^^^ lets see some 500HP+ benzes walk these Z06's right?

https://mbworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=245614

Originally Posted by juicee63

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...&highlight=AMG

Wow, Improviz? You may not like Jangy, and have many valid points but Jangy is NOT STOCK, like others his car is likely very fast and certainly capable of dispatching a STOCK Z06.


This can all be settled easily , Fontana is 2.5 weeks away, and the Corvette enthusiast's are always at this event. A 500 RWHP any AMG will keep up with a stock Z. Guys who are confused, who wish to test Improviz's hypothesis that a heavily modded E55 will be toast are welcome to bring the Z06 out to www.alternativemotoring.com 06/13/08. Blue Monster may want a shot at a Z as well as some other heavily modded 55's. You said it best its about weight and hp and 80 plus over stock erases the Z's weight advantage.

DJE55 has both cars his Z06 stock ran

"The car has ran 11.42 at 126 stock with the stock run flats".
His E55
"The car really moves. It ran 11.3's in the 1/4 at 123mph on street tires"

He also raced a C5Z06 with 4 people in his E55 and won!

This is a Kleeman K1/K2? car and it keeps up with the 08 Z.

http://www.fquick.com/videos/viewvideo.php?id=1221

Originally Posted by rflow306

Juice you are forgetting to mention what you always mention, the weather. It was in the high 80's to low 90's the day he ran the 11.42, may car ran repeated 11.39's and 11.40 at 123.8 that day. Had we raced rolling there is no doubt in my mind he would pull on me. His Zo6 was also not stock it had an intake and ecu tune if I remember correctly. The only way I could have let him take off first in a rolling race and drive around him is if I sprayed him.

My car was trapping 3-4mph higher than any e55 there and me and Jaye55 were running very similar times. DJE55 had 50deg weather when his e55 ran 11.30's.
We have seen what the ZO6 can do in that weather.

Originally Posted by juicee63

Yeah but Albert comon man its a close race especially if his Z would have been 100%stock. Weather definately matters and in the HEAT the E55 has an advantage over the 63 and the N/A LS3, LS2, 7.0 yep that SC is amazing

Originally Posted by juicee63

Yeah but Albert comon man its a close race especially if his Z would have been 100%stock. Weather matters alot.. Sorry for not mentioning it I actually pulled that info from DJE55's cardomain page. Cool you were there, did you race head to head vs. the Z06?

Originally Posted by rflow306

The race in question was a rolling race were Jangy let him take off first and then drove around him. I have never questioned his story because on the street anything can happen and a win is win but to say I thought they were faster and not really all that after only racing one car makes him look arrogant. Which is what caused this thread to spiral out of control (just my 2 cents).

I hope he understands that what happened to him is the exception and not the norm. Btw this is coming from someone who has hated Chevy's pretty much my entire life but the facts are the facts.

Originally Posted by jangy

Exception or not, it happenned and it is really the only real life perspective I have on those cars. Screw it, add in on the crowd and call BS. Like I'd care. I did give the dude the jump, not the first time. The first run, i was pumped and ready to have my rear handed to me. It didn't happen, so i continued to play to find where our cars would compete.

Rflow, for you to think that I could spend a solid 45 minutes playing with the dude and that he just couldn't get a single rolling run is a bit naive as well. That is three runs in a row against "american" muscle cars that NOBODY runs head to head with but all want to say they know what the outcome is.

Maybe my run was an aboration, maybe not. Facts are facts and I haven't bothered to argue my side at all, because this thread is and has been OT.

p.s., I'll be at the drag races, so instead of all this talk, lets start getting all the BS squared:

Imrovization: Make sure one of your supermen is present. I do not want to hear any excuses when whichever Z06 happens to be there gets walked. All I ask is that you crawl back under the OT rock and take the few out of place people in here with you.

Thericker: You've wanted me forever, why not on a legal track? Let me know if that doesn't work and we'll still setup our fun run.

To anyone who has a tune and thinks they are all the same. Show up and lets see. I predict the fastest trap speed from an E55 at these fontana events. I think my 60 will be consistent, but nothing major as will my 1/8th. But, I believe the car will surprise many of you between the 1/8th and 1/4 mile markers.

Originally Posted by rflow306

I don't think we ran heads up, but another thing to consider is that while my car had dr's his car had oem runflats, which is the reason my et's were so consistent.

Originally Posted by rflow306

Juice you are forgetting to mention what you always mention, the weather. It was in the high 80's to low 90's the day he ran the 11.42, my car ran repeated 11.39's and 11.40 at 123.8 that day. Had we raced rolling there is no doubt in my mind he would pull on me. His Zo6 was also not stock it had an intake and ecu tune if I remember correctly. The only way I could have let him take off first in a rolling race and drive around him is if I sprayed him.

My car was trapping 3-4mph higher than any e55 there and me and Jaye55 were running very similar times. DJE55 had 50deg weather when his e55 ran 11.30's.
We have seen what the ZO6 can do in that weather, just look at dragtimes.

Originally Posted by juicee63

If a few coins on the floor can make a difference , certainly SIXTY POUNDS extra could sink you. Sixty pounds is going to add .06-.1 to your acceleration measure, if you do not think 6/100ths matters then you have likely never raced anyone or anything

Originally Posted by Improviz

Hey, Juice: you were lecturing me about 60 pounds a few posts up, and now you're comparing runs done in 90 degree weather to runs done in 50 degree weather? Each 10 degree drop adds about 10 hp; that's going to make a helluvalot more difference than the 0.06 sec you get from 60 pounds!



Hmm, go to youtube and look for some vids there of me not racing...somehow, I managed to do pretty well.

Also, I did not say that 6/100ths does not matter; point was, it's not enough to make up for the OTHER 940 pounds.

But hey, we'll find out one of these days, if we can ever get the two cars lined up.

Originally Posted by Improviz

Hey, Juice: you were lecturing me about 60 pounds a few posts up, and now you're comparing runs done in 90 degree weather to runs done in 50 degree weather? Each 10 degree drop adds about 10 hp; that's going to make a helluvalot more difference than the 0.06 sec you get from 60 pounds!



Hmm, go to youtube and look for some vids there of me not racing...somehow, I managed to do pretty well.

Also, I did not say that 6/100ths does not matter; point was, it's not enough to make up for the OTHER 940 pounds.

But hey, we'll find out one of these days, if we can ever get the two cars lined up.

Originally Posted by juicee63

I know my bad, I had no idea when those runs happened just that the owner of both cars felt his E55 was every bit as strong as his 08 Z06. The weather may have been what caused the original Z06 to be Jangyfied. 100 hp and tq would erase the 900 lbs but I think from all of this we see clearly the Z is very very very scary from a roll and can be on the drag strip as well. I just think a heavily modded 55 can , could , may dispatch a stock Z06.

Originally Posted by juicee63

Jangy will show up and hopefully he can run side by side an 07 Z, I have posted on the Corvette forum in hopes we can get a few to attend. So far there is a C6 Z51 and an 07 Z06 coming. Relax one way or another the 55 will have its day on the track. Plenty of guys in this Forum have lost to the Z, and plenty have dispatched them